PDA

View Full Version : Coaching problems or player personnal?



patsdude114
02-27-2013, 08:43 PM
Simple question here.... is it coaching or just the players themselves?

I for 1 cant stand the boring style we play, it doesnt develop skill its like watching robots play. Doesnt matter which line it is they all play the same boring way....pass it towards the boards skate til hit red line chip it in, if by chance we still have the puck crossing the redline the Dmen just angle us towards the boards cuz we have no desire to use the middle of the ice.

We have some players who if they used the open ice could create chances like Scheidl, Stephenson, Klimchuk, along with to a lesser degree in Stevenson, Williams, McCoy....but when your told to keep it along the boards you limit urself where you can skate, you cant make any cuts to get around a guy cuz the Dmen know exactly where you wanna go & thats along the boards.

If you cant carry the puck thru the middle at this level you dont deserve to be in the league. God a guy like Doty on MH makes our skilled guys even look retarded. MH coach even lets him use the middle of the ice, but yet our fools for coaches want the whole team to play like 4th liners. Its sickening as a fan to watch, I personally feel that this will be the last franchise that will ever give Conacher a Head Coaching job. Yes he was a hard worker when he was a player but thats all he preaches, he doesnt develop players to play this style of hockey.

Developing skill will always beat hard workers, cuz skilled players will score on chances they get hard workers will get stopped cuz all hard workers do is just want to get the puck on net as quickly as possible instead of taking your time & putting the puck where u want it.

There's no more excuses for this 2nd 1/2 of the season we have had a fairly healthly lineup to compete. This 2nd 1/2 falls fully onto the coaching staff & there lack of skill within there systems. There is nothing within our game that shows any creativity to make a play.

This season was a huge disappointment & falls onto the coaching staff, I for 1 hope Conacher & staff are let go after this year. The Pats are 3-14-1-1 since trade deadline only wins coming against BRN/MJ & surprisingly EDM..... we were 18-20-2-3 before trade deadline which put us in 8th in the conference for 2days... I highly doubt Conacher & staff will be let go after this season, I do hope it happens but im not holding my breath on it either.

Not sure if many remember how McCoy looked in his 1st 2 games as a Pats player but he was always coasting in the middle of the ice waiting for a pass for the breakout thru the middle, he looked like a completely different player when he 1st came here.. that is until he learned our systems & realised all we do is chip it off the glass. Samoridny was the same way he would look for a cross ice pass to the weak side at the start but now its just push the puck deep & chase it. These 2 players are prime examples of how they looked much better when they 1st came here then they do now.

My rant is over after i turned off the game on the webcast tonite against the Raiders in disgust in how we play. Not sure if its even worth going to the game on Friday nite against the Warriors, the highlight will be having coffee with my father before the game starts.

Some_Arrogant_Jerk
02-28-2013, 02:22 AM
Guess I can only remain quiet for so long...

Although the wheels have fallen off due to a variety of reasons, firing Conacher, the coach of the year nominee last year, would be moronic. He has another year here and he is not the problem. The fact is that this team needs more skill, rather than changing coaches until the circle shape goes through the square hole. We have some players overacheiving as it is already, and the way he runs his systems, we need more high quality offensive players for him to work with(probably wouldnt have these powerplay troubles if that were the case).

The culture change we keep hearing about has not been dramatic and so the waiting time is going to be longer than a year or two. We are still going through some growing pains here.

These results, although disappointing, were apart of the risk at the deadline as well. Its a period in the year when teams prepare for the playoffs, and competition gets even stiffer. If you take a step back like we did dealing Mayor and cutting the older players, while other teams only get stronger, it becomes that much more difficult to keep the consistency up(unless you are Kootenay apparently).

Perhaps things wouldve been different if we had a healthy blueline, and maybe if we got better goaltending. But that is the nature of things. The bright side is that the moves that were made have made this team all the more better for next year. This is still a letdown, especially considering this is not at all new for this city's team, but a step back it is not. If we went the other way at the deadline, we would be staring down the barrel of a 5 game playoff series against edmonton or the looney tunes.

patsdude114
02-28-2013, 03:11 AM
His coach of the year nonimee was souly due to Weal carrying the team all season long, not cuz what he implimented was exciting hockey. The defense was much older too which did help with not giving up many quality chances with no offensive support.

I never said i wanted the Pats to add anything at trade deadline that would of been flat out stupid. As for our PP, it is so predictable it hasnt changed in 2 seasons only difference is we dont have a true playmaker llike Weal who gained alot of respect on the ice for his ice creativity from other teams that he got more room then he prob should of. We play 4 players high slot & higher with no net presence.

As for over acheiving players....who has over acheived this year? i cant name 1 player who has over acheived, i predicted from the start of training camp that both Scheidl & Klimchuk would score 30+ goals & both have. I dont know why u say "maybe if we got better goaltending", that is 1 of the few bright spots we have this year. If it wasnt for Hewitt this season would of looked liked our 12win season & prob even worse maybe took stoon for a running for there 7 win season.

When i even hear scouts saying that Regina plays such a boring game i think that speaks volumes on how the hockey operations are running things. I like the players Lang has brought in this year Mccoy/Samoridny/Henry/Hak only sad thing is every one of them looked better when they 1st got here then they do now. Excluding Hak he has been prob the most improved player since xmas break, but then it helps too not playing in all situations that he wasnt ready for like during the 1st half alittle lesser of a role before Jobke & Fenske got hurt really helped him alot.

I still dont agree with the Rossingol reassignment, not cuz i was a big of his but cuz of what the coaches preached all season long & then doing the complete opposite at trade deadline. I think that played a bigger role in the teams performance then one would think. They always preach that no matter a players age if he is deserving of the ice from his performance he will play in key situations.....well Rossingol was by far our top 3 performers right after xmas during our 5 game winning streak & then they cut him loose like chop liver. Players like Gay & Ortynski would of gotten alot more experience & confidence playing at a lower level, especially Ortynski the kid just was not ready all year long for the WHL. What was the point in keeping a player on the roster that when you did dress him he didnt even see a single shift 90% of the time....ya thats doing lots for his development, it shows they dont trust him enough to play so what was the point in keeping him on the team. Hes not benefitting from sitting on the bench & watching.

One sad thing too was sending Vasko back to europe, im not sure if anyone of u attended any practices prior to trade deadline but he was by far the next best skilled player on the ice behind Schiedl & Klimchuk....the guy had a very quick release & could skate. I think the conditioning problem they said was a joke excuse, the 1 practice out of 3 i seen Cameron blew his whistle 3 times in a matter of 15-20 mins & told Vasko to "dump the f##ken puck in, instead of pulling up" the guy wanted to create a play instead of making his team fight to get the puck back by chipping it in deep. I think it was more of a "were sending you home cuz you dont want to play our style of play" maybe Volek had a bigger reason to stay away this year..... it does make a person think dont it...

mjw22
02-28-2013, 12:04 PM
Have to agree with PD 114 Pats are the most boring team Ive seen this year.We play too much chip and chase for my liking but nothing as bad as you guys. They use that system to limit turn overs at the blueline but it does more harm than good in developing skill that you'll need moving forward. Its done more to keep from getting outchanced and keeps the coach employed lol.I'd rather get beat watching guys carry the puck in and trying to make plays than just dumping it in. At least they would learn what works and what doesnt.

patsdude114
02-28-2013, 01:55 PM
I hope it doesnt keep him employeed going forward either, or at least giving Lang the word that he will change his style & if nothing changes by the 10-15 game mark next season out the door they go.

The younger teams like BRN & MJ play a more exciting style yes they may not get different results then the Pats do much but at least they are trying to play hockey, trying to create plays, learning within the individual what he is & isnt capable of doing on a regular basis. Id much rather watch the kids trying different creative stuff offensively then playing chip n chase 100% of the time....there is a time & place for chip n chase but it shouldnt be the way u play the game from start to finish. Any true hockey fan with any sort of knowledge of game will tell u that as well.

dsquared
02-28-2013, 09:57 PM
I hope it doesn't keep him employed going forward either, or at least giving Lang the word that he will change his style & if nothing changes by the 10-15 game mark next season out the door they go.

The younger teams like BRN & MJ play a more exciting style yes they may not get different results then the Pats do much but at least they are trying to play hockey, trying to create plays, learning within the individual what he is & isnt capable of doing on a regular basis. Id much rather watch the kids trying different creative stuff offensively then playing chip n chase 100% of the time....there is a time & place for chip n chase but it shouldnt be the way u play the game from start to finish. Any true hockey fan with any sort of knowledge of game will tell u that as well.


You do recall that all of the management had their contracts extended before the start of this season? This would mean that terminating any or all of the management team would mean they have a huge financial obligation in the the next couple of years - paying for 2 sets of GMs and coaches.

Somebody told me something I found hard to believe - could someone confirm or deny it?

The story goes that there are actually some junior hockey teams don't end their seasons in March - they actually play hockey in April and May!!! - Can this really be true?

My version of Pats play by play on any night this season:

The other team moves into the Pats zone, the Pats struggle to gain control of the puck, chasing players of the other team and losing the 1 on 1 battles. (If they can gain control of the puck without giving up a goal or taking a penalty) The Pats will skate up ice and chip the puck up along the boards, they will try and gain control of the opponent's zone, but send nobody into the slot. They once again find that they lose the 1 on 1 battles and the other team quickly moves the puck up ice without any opposition from the Pats and we repeat the cycle over and over all night... but it was another moral victory.. ..

patsdude114
03-01-2013, 12:35 AM
You do recall that all of the management had their contracts extended before the start of this season? This would mean that terminating any or all of the management team would mean they have a huge financial obligation in the the next couple of years - paying for 2 sets of GMs and coaches.



I never said that Lang wont be here, he has made the nessaccary moves for this team to move forward. Its the coaching staff that runs the show when it comes to how the game is played on the ice. Also it was only Lang who got a 2yr extention not the coaches, next season will be the final year of Conacher's 3yr deal & i believe Cameron & Dixon got 3yr deals too but i could be wrong with that.

Bighat
03-01-2013, 12:46 PM
Asst coaches sign a year to year contract. Looks like a nice draft pick this year, I'm not a fan of chip and change I mean chase hockey either. Hopefully we use a different system next year with an older club.

nivek_wahs
03-01-2013, 12:49 PM
My vote isn't for either.

My vote goes higher up the ladder.

patsdude114
03-01-2013, 01:33 PM
For some reason bighat guy I'm fairly sure you are wrong with that statement of asst coaches sign a year to year contract. They normally get the same 3yr term a head coach gets cuz the head coach picks his guys to work with for the term, just with asst coaches they have a out clause where they can take a head coaching job at the same level. The head coach gets an out clause too where he can take any position if he is moving up in level like pro hockey.

As for Kev as much as I'd love to blame the Parker's for this its really hard to blame them. On ice performance is longer there fault unless its karama still coming back to bite this franchise in the arse for the many yrs of terrible GM'ing by BP. When Lang has done a full over haul on the roster with countless trades (especially in his 1st year) its hard to point at BP still.

dsquared
03-01-2013, 04:46 PM
What are prospects for the 2013-2014 season?

I do not see a huge improvement next season:

1) We lose Scheidl (70 points), Jobke (he has missed more games than he has played) and Hewitt and probably Sylvegard (I can't see burning a 20 yo spot and a a euro spot on him) I don't see any one or two players making up for the loss in goal production.

2) Our 20 yo's look like Ouellette, Stevenson, & Fenske all of whom are average players. What will the Blades be unloading after the Memorial Cup?

3)From what I saw in training camp there is nobody in the system that is capable of putting any kind of offensive production. The one possibility is Liam Finlay who is vertically challenged at 5'5".

4) We should end up with a decent Euro pick - but they always seem like a shot in the dark or have issues with Regina(eg Volek & Hanzal).

I see the Pats having another season like this year and maybe worse - If they tank next season we should start seeing a turn around in 2-3 seasons when the Pats start to hopefully see some their drafting produce results - unless they trade away those high draft picks. - I see more 2 for 1 nights, Wiener Wednesdays, and Thirsty Thursdays in my crystal ball

nivek_wahs
03-01-2013, 05:37 PM
As for Kev as much as I'd love to blame the Parker's for this its really hard to blame them. On ice performance is longer there fault unless its karama still coming back to bite this franchise in the arse for the many yrs of terrible GM'ing by BP. When Lang has done a full over haul on the roster with countless trades (especially in his 1st year) its hard to point at BP still.I don't know if you do the Twitter thing or not but this Tweet at the deadline makes me question how much control Lang has....

https://twitter.com/Patguy65/status/289534924279664640

Brent Parker ‏@Patguy65
Not fun When you are stuck in an office with no windows for 12 hours and come out to snowmagedden. Who knew! #tradedeadlineproblems

nivek_wahs
03-01-2013, 05:39 PM
What are prospects for the 2013-2014 season?Once it is officially done (probably tonight) I think that this should be it's own thread topic.

patsdude114
03-02-2013, 01:02 AM
Well we live for another day of playoff hopes (for what it is worth) I must say tonight I saw plays on the ice that I haven't seen for a very long time by the pats. I actually saw cross ice passes thru the netural zone on a some what regular basis, could tell the plaayers weren't used to making them much though as there was a fair share of turn overs but it was still nice to see some actual hockey attempting to be played. Another thing I noticed too was we actually used the middle man in our zone on break outs.

One player who I thought really excelled tonight was Slyvegard on defense, he looked like a seasoned vetern back there. He rushed the puck about 4 or 5 times, made really good break out passes & showed poise to wait for plays to develop.

We gave up lots of shots but very few were actually any threat for a scoring chance, MJ threw everything on net. I have also never seen Klimchuk skate so fast before during 2 seasons like he did in OT to catch Reilly. Could see Klimchuk mouth the words to Ouellette during the plaay stoppage "god he is fast" (as I always stand in the corner ready to bolt on the winner)

Watching Reilly tonight his speed & his shot with a quick release it definately makes you think that possibly the Leafs will keep him next season. It would be a huge blow to the Warriors if infact it does happen. Reilly is definately more ready then Kadri was at age 20.

Tonights game was definately one of the more physcial games I have seen the pats play this year. We still take way too many shots coming our way, we have zero toughness on our team. Be a freaken man & throw a punch back.

west coast
03-02-2013, 03:09 PM
Another disappointing season in the Queen city.I believe that the Pats are weak on talent.The coach is forced to use a conservative style of coaching .The areas that need addressing are scouting .The team needs to draft better and find the free agents(junior A or American ).The Pats also need to take a serious look at a new GM.The Pats need to find a hockey man that can change the culture and instill a winning atmosphere.It has been a long time since the Pats have resembled a competitive team for any length of time.

Fight Guy
03-02-2013, 07:42 PM
I've been putting off posting because I don't want to rant on too long, but...

As for whether it's player, coaching, management, scouting, or higher up even, I can't choose just one.

Players...Though the Pats don't have the most talented team, they weren't really expected to be the most talented this season. Whether or not you want to start blaming moves and decisions in the past, this is what the Pats had this season. Though I believe they have a lot more talent than the majority of critics seem to give credit. Earlier in the season, and even last season, we saw some of the players that were expected to step it up when veterans moved on. Early in the season, Ouellette, Stephenson, and Stevenson all looked good. Unfortunately for Ouellette and Stephenson, they got hurt early on and it definitely slowed them both down. When Ouellette got back, he never really had the same spark he had before his injury, but still worked hard and threw his body around, when Stephenson got back, he looked a little slow at first and then started racking up some points. Then it dropped off again after those first few games. D'Amico also looked very promising in training camp and pre-season until he got hurt. Losing out of that much of the season as a rookie is going to hurt most any player in his situation. Not to mention Hunt going down early also and never making it back. Players like Christoffer and Rodewald didn't do as much as I would have liked. Christoffer took a little longer than I expected to find his game and the past month or so, he has been great and I really hope he sticks around next season. Rodewald...he plays a good, hard working game, but with his size, he should be hitting a hell of a lot more than he does. He strays away from a great hit opportunity more often than he makes a great hit. It's a little mind boggling when Klimchuck lays better hits than Rodewald. Also, have to agree with PD114 on Rossignol. He was playing awesome after Christmas. Best player on the ice most nights...then he gets sent down. Ortynski sticks around and probably played a total of 43 seconds since the trade deadline. He needs the development and confidence, not Rossignol, the player who has found it! Mayor was also looking good this season.

The young defensemen looked good most of the year. They didn't do too badly considering the older, more experienced defensive core they had last season. Last season, the Pats were actually said to have had one of the top defenses in the league. It doesn't help that the captain only played like 20 games this season. When Jobke came back the first time, he ignited the defense and the entire team. He and Fenske are the key veterans on the rear, and when they both get hurt, there's not a whole lot you can do unless you start making some trades or have a coach that can develop the younger players instead of playing more conservatively.

Anyone who says the Pats need better goaltending is just down right retarded. If you're offended by that because you fall into that category, too bad, because it's the truth. Hewitt has been amazing all season and Sacher is looking great behind him. Really wish he got some more starts this season, but when he did, he looked good and I would expect him to fall into the starting roll next season... unless someone else steals the show, then he'll probably get traded so he can play. At least that's what I would want to see in that case.

Now to blame their lack of scoring on their talent, I think that's completely unfair. Getting the players to play to their full potential and to keep working hard is mostly on the coaches. I can't comment too deeply on coaching as I can only comment on what I have seen in game play. I don't see what they are doing in practice.

Like PD114 has said, Conacher was lucky last season. Not just because of Weal, but because the experience of the team in general. The defense was top end and the offense wasn't too bad. Weal really helped out that aspect, sure, but we also had a lack of powerplay last season, which from what I have seen, looked the exact same this season. That is coaching. There are times when the players make the choice to pass the puck around some more, but when you don't have anyone in front of the net to clean up the garbage on those outside shots (when a shot actually gets off...), then you're not going to have much success.

Conacher claimed that he had to resort to a more conservative approach when the Pats were down numerous players, but when they came back, not a whole lot changed. They won some more games and some of the players started playing better(Rossignol, Christoffer). I think this had to do with less pressure with more experienced players stepping back in and allowing some confidence to build...which is completely normal. Then Rossignol gets sent down for working hard and the Pats completely fall off the edge. Just a lot of the same bull**** we saw earlier in the season with less results.

West Coast says that Conacher has been forced to coach a conservative style. Sure, earlier in the season, that might be a good idea so that you don't fall completely under, but when it's later in the season, and the things you're teaching aren't working, don't you think you need to change something rather than piling up loss after loss after loss after loss after loss after loss after OT loss after loss?!?!?!!? Nope, instead the players keep playing the same sad sack systems they have all season and are now the laughing stock of the league. Actually, it's gotten to the point where I think the opposing fans stopped laughing and are starting to feel sorry for the Pats and their fans.

Back to talent. How are the players supposed to show they're talented when they're not allowed to be creative?? It seems only Jobke, Klimchuck and Scheidl were the only players who were really given any freedom to make some plays. Last season, Stephenson and Stevenson both showed they were capable of making plays. That may or may not have been on a line with Weal, but you're really building confidence dumping the puck constantly and not allowing them the chance to try and get better.

That brings me to the mid season trades. I'm only going to get into the ones I thought were more key. Henry, McCoy, and Samoridny all looked good when they first got here, then their play dropped off. McCoy still found more success with the Pats, but that's because he got the opportunity to play here. Samoridny actually has been one of the few players who has come here and not looked amazing his first few games. Not that that's a bad thing, because he has still been good when in the line up, but he too has had injury problems this season. As for Henry, it's sad with him. The way he came out his first game and the way he was advertised in the paper, it sounded like we were getting a Beach type player. Was working hard, hitting, getting under the opponents skin. Then that stopped and was even a healthy scratch on many occasions. He had promise to give the Pats an element they haven't had since JD Watt came here and started stirring things up. They may be more penalty prone, but a team needs that presence on the ice. Hell, I've never seen a less physical team this season in general. It's also my understanding that the other teams have no respect for the Pats as they aren't physical. They just do their thing and the Pats, for the most part, let them. You need to intimidate the opposing team and make them think twice about making certain plays. Instead, the Pats don't hit and we get walked all over a majority of games. I don't recall the 12 win season having as many blow out losses as they did this season.

Back to players being traded here. It's been a problem for years now. The Pats trade for an amazing player, they come here, and look amazing their first few games, then they learn the systems, and their play for the most part, digresses. This isn't completely the coaches or GM's fault though. When you pick up older players who have played in winning systems for two/three seasons then make them play a different game than they have been developed to play, then there's a chance they are going to digress. Some of the good players will get past this, but when the coach is correcting something that is FAR from broken, then you have the case of players like Henry, McCoy, and Samoridny. They came from teams that are high in the standings, learning things that win games.

Now some of this has also strayed from the comments on Rod's blog. It's there that many people have ragged on the team not having enough talent. I've also read a few times that the coach can only do some much with what he's given. Well those comments are stupid considering this is the juniors and you're expected to develop the players skills and make them better and prepare them for the pros. Not just simply coach them. That's what pro coaches do. Sure, they help develop players differently too, but in juniors it's different. Brent Sutter learned that. He's back in juniors doing what he does best...getting the most out of kids. Good junior coaches know how to develop their players and make the not so talented players play their best. Conacher and company just simply has not been very good at this. Instead, is just preaching the same things over and over and getting the same results.

When it comes to coaching and peoples beliefs, they think that because Conacher came here and got a coach of the year honour his first season, he is the answer and everything else is the problem. Though I do commend him for changing the culture in the dressing room last season, and his "team first" philosophy, but with the younger group this season, his true colours are starting to show now. Give this team to Sutter or Hay or McCrimmon, and I bet we see MUCH better results. Also think because Gretzky endorsed him, people hold that as credentials. Gretzky says he'll be a good coach, but reall, what does he know about coaching??

To be honest, one thing that really hurt the Pats a few years ago was when Curtis Hunt jumped ship to the NHL. It near the end of that season that the players were really starting to buy into his systems and things were looking good. Then they brought an offensive minded Derkatch, who presented a 180 in philosophies to a team that was coached with defense in mind a year earlier. Then Hunt came back and that ship had already sunk. Had Hunt not left, I bet, even now, things wouldn't look as bad.

As for management, I think Lang has done a damn good job with what he had. Though there are still some trades that had Parker written all over them, Lang has done a great job bringing in players to fill certain gaps and hasn't hurt the future doing so. The biggest Parker-esque trade, to me, was Marincin last season. They didn't need a scoring defensemen, but scoring up front. Sure, he did help and produced a lot, but giving up Blidstrand wasn't the best move.

A lot of people have gotten on Lang's case for not moving players this season. Well, you can go and ship all you're older players off for younger players, but the price still needs to be right. You don't just go sell them off for whatever and hope for the best. Players like Scheidl and Stevenson were players he tried to move, but if the deal doesn't give a decent return, then you prob shouldn't just throw them away. It's my understanding Stevenson was part of a very generous deal that would have seen the Pats land Forsberg from PG. This wouldn't have hurt us now, and made us better the next few years. But PG decided to punish him instead. Though, now that we've seen what has gone down since the trade deadline, maybe him coming wouldn't have helped that much.

People who say Lang needs to go are also kinda stupid. In his time here, they have gotten a new coach and a new head scout. You can't give a GM three/four years in junior, and if they're not winning, fire him. Junior hockey needs more time and patients. West Coast also mentioned that management and scouting are issues. Well, scouting has changed, and we won't see the effects of that really for a couple more years, so that is a non issue till we see where it actually goes. He also says they need a hockey person as GM. Pretty sure Lang was a player who wasn't too bad for the Pat Canadians and Kindersly Klippers. There was a large article on him this season that went through his career, and I found out he has been a part of hockey his entire life. My only issue with Lang is the lingering Parker issue...

There are things that really screamed Parker the past few season with Lang in charge, and until he is completely out of the picture and there are new owners in place, will I truly be happy. Though he has done some great thing for the organization, like bring in an All-Star game in '98, the Mem Cup in '01 and just bringing fans back into the stands in general. It was when it came to hockey that he faltered. He's a great business man but should have stepped down long before he did when his teams weren't doing ****.

Not really much else to say about Parker in a hockey capacity, as he has been the center of it all for years now, and frankly, I don't want to talk about it anymore. Instead, there are new problems I have with him.

Though, some of these "fan appreciation" promotions (most notably the 2for1 ticket prices) are great for part time, first time, and weekend fans, it seems us season ticket holders just get a curling iron up the ass!! If he really wanted us to feel appreciated, he would set something up for just the season ticket holders. Instead, we have to pay for playoff tickets before the season even begins, and if we don't make the playoffs, then we can use that money we paid as credit toward season tickets next season, which with him around, seems to be the start of a vicious cycle. To me, he's on his last legs and is trying his hardest to stay relevant. He should do the whole organization a favour and sell the team before next season (LOL!). I say this because if the Pats manage to be successful next season under these coaches and management, then he won't be going anywhere. :dead:

Well, this was what I was afraid of. May as well make this the start of a seasons end thread. I probably left out some things that I wanted to say, and if I did, I will add them as they come to me. There may also be some stuff that might not make sense, but after seeing how long my post is, I'm not proofing this ****! That's all for now though.

If I wanted to, I could get into the way the Brandt Center is run, but that's not the Pats.

patsdude114
03-02-2013, 09:32 PM
well for starters there is no way im quoting this last post by fight guy take a full page just to quote it lol

But with that said i agree with everything fight guy has to say, from how the team is ran, to the 1yr impliment of Derkatch to the season ticket holders getting the short end of the stick but part time fans getting great benefits. Last night i had forgotten my ticket at home & didnt realise it til i got to the game, the people in the ticket office couldnt even call the Pats office for me since i enter on that far side to prove that i was a season ticket holder...so i was forced to buy a ticket & then to top it off they refused to give me the 2nd ticket for free which was i just going to give away to a kid waiting in line.

Watching the game yet again tonight on the webcast the play style of the Pats is changing for some reason at the end of the year when it no longer matters.... last night they werent chipping it in every single rush, they were actually making cross ice passes on the rush & pretty much the same again tonight in MJ.... now why on earth at the end of the year when the games no longer matter to us does the coaching staff change how we are playing?

Ive always said there is a time & place for the chip it in game but not every single rush like how we played all season long...i fully get why they played that way before xmas we were so short handed with injuries that it was the safest way we could play. This time of the year playing the way we are these last 2 games should of been how we were playing after xmas/after trade deadline.

Do the coaches finally think that we have the talent now to play this different in the systems? Its the same freaken team as it was after trade deadline just minus Jobke & Fenske....

I must say though that im glad someone else (fight guy) see's the same things i have been seeing these past few weeks...some of the comments i have read from some guys (not mentioning any names at all) have really made me question if they were watching the same games as i was...& dont even get me started with roddy's blog on the Pats comments, i dont think there is a poster on there who would know what a skilled hockey player was unless he put up a 100pts.

One of the major problems i see on the Pats PP is the players down low play too much within the PK's box where it makes them pretty useless for a pass down low.... Lang finally brought in some bigger bodies but yet we still have zero net presence on the PP or in the game in general... Rodewald/Samoridny/McCoy 1 of these guys sould responsibility should be to stand infront of that net & provide a screen/take a Dman away to move there big bodies out.

I think Sylvegard should look at a position change, 2 games in a row now he has looked really good on defense, plus he even scored something he hasnt done since Nov. 3rd....the way he moved the puck last night & tonight showing poise I wouldnt be upset at all if the Pats used him as a 20yr old Dman (which i know isnt going to happen) he makes better breakout passes then Fenske does.

Now that starts me on the Fenske topic alone.... i love his physical presence on the backend he competes hard each & every shift but his puck skills are limited at best. Along with not fighting once this year really makes me question his heart & desire to be a Regina Pats player for next season. Hes a guy who has forgotten what kept him in the league & that he needs to fullfill this role still while taking on a bigger role with on ice production (which doesnt include points). Im still not sure if Fenske has the skill to move forward next season with the Pats....

Guys like Erik Donald (who should of been on the team over Mumby, a topic all in itself) Chase Harrison, Brady Reagan (whos a lock next year), all should be given the chance to play over Fenske. It wont surprise me if Mumby doesnt make the team next season either, I think he will fall in the foot steps as Bortsmayer, a player who wasnt ready as a 16yr old & then failed to keep a spot the rest of his career.

Bighat
03-02-2013, 10:23 PM
I totally agree with the last 2 posts especially mumby. I think Donald is going the college route. I for one think the pats will be significantly improved next year. The addition of 2 new euros and likely 2 16yr olds and 2 17yr olds. We should be bigger and faster. I still think forsberg will end up here over the summer.

Fight Guy
03-02-2013, 10:30 PM
I have to say, I never made it to last nights game as I was sick at home with a flu. That usually doesn't stop me, but the way the Pats have played, I didn't really care. Turned out they played a pretty good and exciting game compared to usual. Because of that (and MJs in house feed is deadly for replays) I decided to get this game. Only I completely lost track of time writing my retardedly long post. Luckily when I did order it, I was able to rewind. Sometimes it doesn't work.

Anyway, after rewinding and skimming through the game till I watched live at the start of the second, I started feeling like my words in my previous post were kinda harsh. It was a different game. It was nice to watch!

Sylvegard does look good on defense. It crossed my mind as well, if he can excel at defense, I wouldn't mind seeing him take a double spot next season. He has been good this season but is not a finisher. I feel like his first two goals were from out far too. He has puck skill and can move the puck, but he can't do anything with it when he gets to the net. Which now it almost just seems to make sense that he would make a good puck moving/PP defenseman. But, good to find these things out the night you get eliminated from playoff contention...

Really don't see how Wyton got a major for his goaltender interference. He was pushed into Hewitt even more than Burroughs did Paulic. Burroughs was tripped up and directed into the net by the MJ player. Not sure if it was Morse that did it then went after him, but either way, both should have been no more than 2mins. Burroughs was even trying to get out of the way. If he doesn't jump and end up head over heels, he's laying on top of Paulic in the net.

Not sure if Gallo and colour guy realize people watching the feed can hear them when they take a commercial break. It was comical how much of a homer the guy is! I hear Phil Andrews isn't much better, but I rarely see his games called...so I wouldn't know. But Gallo was taking it personally like the penalties have to be even. There were some missed and weak calls, but the Pats were pretty disciplined. That's just what happens when you make the other team play YOUR game...something the Pats have maybe enjoyed once after the deadline. The Pats have fallen victim to it this season too.

Gallo also accused the WHL gamesheet of being wrong for powerplays. He thought the Pats had more PP's than it said. When he called the fights too, that was pretty funny also. But, I can't hold that against him. That's often how Pedersen called them.

Now we wait and see if this style continues for the final few games here. If so, I'm gonna be very disappointed.

Fight Guy
03-02-2013, 10:31 PM
I still think forsberg will end up here over the summer.
And for less!

patsdude114
03-03-2013, 04:02 AM
just a quick stat before i head off to bed....

the pats as a team have the 4th most fights in the WHL.... we must fight an aweful lot on the road cuz we sure in hell dont fight at home.

here is the link from hockeyfights.com for this season http://www.hockeyfights.com/leaders/teams/5/reg2013

Fight Guy
03-03-2013, 06:23 AM
just a quick stat before i head off to bed....

the pats as a team have the 4th most fights in the WHL.... we must fight an aweful lot on the road cuz we sure in hell dont fight at home.

here is the link from hockeyfights.com for this season http://www.hockeyfights.com/leaders/teams/5/reg2013

I believe Stevensen himself has like, 3 fights at home and 13 or more on the road...

patsdude114
03-03-2013, 12:02 PM
I for 1 would love to see the BC a tougher place to come into, not just meaning fights but they also help with making it a tougher building. Too much turning the cheek the other way when we are on home ice. Fans want entertainment as well & haven't heard the home crowd booo a home player before for dropping the mits.......

Well I guess its offically offical the Pats are out of the playoffs but for the record the Warriors were eliminated about 1 hour before the Pats were (for what that is worth:groovy: ) as much as I don't want to see the wins now just for a better draft pick its still nice as a fan to beat the Warriors. Haha yes I'm trying to salvage something with this team.

Does anyone know if Reagan's season is almost done? I would love to see him come in & play the remainding games as an audition for next year or what about that Schloer kid (not sure on spelling & only on my phone).

Also I too will be disappointed if we continue playing this new way with the slight system adjustments. Not cuz I don't want to see abit more creativity but cuz why on earth weren't they made over a month ago? I know it was only MJ they are just as bad as we are but as a guy who has seen many many hockey games over the years it wasn't haard to notice on friday night (watching live) & saturday night (on webcast) that there have been slight adjustments in how we enter the zone & break out of our own zone. Also with that said it was much more effective then before. I'm not against the chip n chase just there is a time & place for it & also depending what line you are on as well.

Well let's see what happens tonight, win or lose the rest of the year we are still assured a top 5 pick & believe Merkley was taken before Klimchuk was & I'd rather have Klimchuk then Merkley any day......

Bighat
03-03-2013, 12:37 PM
Scholer isn't a very good skater and I feel he won't make the whl in his career, but he does have Finnish. We have a couple other guys I'd like to see but we haven't played the 16 yr olds we have much so I think they should receive more ice time first. Klimchuck is only going to get better and his speed is a non issue he caught Reilly the other nite and proved he has the wheels. Some scouts say his speed is an issue and others say he has above average speed. Klimchuck and Stephenson are going to do some damage next season.

patsdude114
03-03-2013, 02:08 PM
By no means am I using this as a comparison but if my memory serves me right a certain player by the name of Stone was a brutal skater as well at 16 yes he had more offensive upside. One thing that Scholer brings is the willingness to throw the body something this franchise lacks. He was among the final cuts with the 16yr olds he isn't as far away as 1 may think. His physical presence along helps his cause.

I agree we should be seeing more minutes now from our 16yr olds but then again we only have 2 16yr olds who are worth anything, I'm just not a fan of Ortynski at the moment he wasn't ready for the WHL level & it shows by how much ice time he gets in a game

Bighat
03-03-2013, 02:32 PM
I maybe wrong with schooler but his skating reminds me a lot of Curtis tippler. Mumby will be lucky to make the team next year.

west coast
03-03-2013, 06:35 PM
Fans cant blame the players - the talent level has to get better .Even the Pats players will tell you that the Pats are too small , too slow and not talented.How can they expect to play a skill game when they do not have the skill in the line up to match up against other clubs.God help the scouts ! I would like to see more American players in the line up .Isnt there an american scout on the payroll.I hope the GM Lang has a plan in place .I dont consider Lang a hockey man.His resume may be impressive at the minor hockey or junior A level but this is the WHL. Surely there are all kinds of former WHL players or coaches with experience and all kinds of WHL networking skills that would be a better candidate for GM than Chad Lang.

Bighat
03-03-2013, 10:02 PM
Lets start off with my buddy won the 50-50 tonite pulocks cousin as irony would have it. I'm not pleased with Pat Conicher at all, we're out of the playoffs play the fning 4th line. To sit there and get 2, 1 and ZERO shifts give me a break you should be ashamed of yourself. HELLO we're out of the playoffs, and it was nice to see the top line play wide open hockey. The other lines still played a lot of chip and chase. All in all a good weekend but a little too late.

patsdude114
03-03-2013, 10:55 PM
What do you mean D'Amico seen 3 shifts alone in the 3rd Ortynski seen 2 shifts & think Gay was dressed wasn't he? Lmao I agree he needs to roll every line now, I get you still play the game to win but give some guys a chance already.

I thought the top 2 lines did a great job again tonight at moving the puck thru the middle entering the offensive zone but my question is why on earth give the guys the freedom now when its been a huge problem since early january. I've been saying for a long time on here & on roddys blog & phils blog that we play chip n chase all game long with no creativity. We are finally seeing some but its alittle too freaken late!!!! I don't care if we lose every game from here on out as long as we are trying to be creative that is how hockey is suppose to be played after all. Coaches ruin the gaame of hockey with all this defensive non sense.

mjw22
03-03-2013, 11:11 PM
What do you mean D'Amico seen 3 shifts alone in the 3rd Ortynski seen 2 shifts & think Gay was dressed wasn't he? Lmao I agree he needs to roll every line now, I get you still play the game to win but give some guys a chance already.

I thought the top 2 lines did a great job again tonight at moving the puck thru the middle entering the offensive zone but my question is why on earth give the guys the freedom now when its been a huge problem since early january. I've been saying for a long time on here & on roddys blog & phils blog that we play chip n chase all game long with no creativity. We are finally seeing some but its alittle too freaken late!!!! I don't care if we lose every game from here on out as long as we are trying to be creative that is how hockey is suppose to be played after all. Coaches ruin the gaame of hockey with all this defensive non sense.

not all coaches just the ones who cant teach offense.

Bighat
03-04-2013, 03:12 PM
Like I said dmeico saw 2 shifts brooks 1 and the other guy 0. Gay was a scratch. I watched the whole game just to see how many shifts they would get. Sad really.

ThoughtfulObserver
03-04-2013, 04:25 PM
His coach of the year nonimee was souly due to Weal carrying the team all season long, not cuz what he implimented was exciting hockey. The defense was much older too which did help with not giving up many quality chances with no offensive support.

I never said i wanted the Pats to add anything at trade deadline that would of been flat out stupid. As for our PP, it is so predictable it hasnt changed in 2 seasons only difference is we dont have a true playmaker llike Weal who gained alot of respect on the ice for his ice creativity from other teams that he got more room then he prob should of. We play 4 players high slot & higher with no net presence.

As for over acheiving players....who has over acheived this year? i cant name 1 player who has over acheived, i predicted from the start of training camp that both Scheidl & Klimchuk would score 30+ goals & both have. I dont know why u say "maybe if we got better goaltending", that is 1 of the few bright spots we have this year. If it wasnt for Hewitt this season would of looked liked our 12win season & prob even worse maybe took stoon for a running for there 7 win season.

When i even hear scouts saying that Regina plays such a boring game i think that speaks volumes on how the hockey operations are running things. I like the players Lang has brought in this year Mccoy/Samoridny/Henry/Hak only sad thing is every one of them looked better when they 1st got here then they do now. Excluding Hak he has been prob the most improved player since xmas break, but then it helps too not playing in all situations that he wasnt ready for like during the 1st half alittle lesser of a role before Jobke & Fenske got hurt really helped him alot.

I still dont agree with the Rossingol reassignment, not cuz i was a big of his but cuz of what the coaches preached all season long & then doing the complete opposite at trade deadline. I think that played a bigger role in the teams performance then one would think. They always preach that no matter a players age if he is deserving of the ice from his performance he will play in key situations.....well Rossingol was by far our top 3 performers right after xmas during our 5 game winning streak & then they cut him loose like chop liver. Players like Gay & Ortynski would of gotten alot more experience & confidence playing at a lower level, especially Ortynski the kid just was not ready all year long for the WHL. What was the point in keeping a player on the roster that when you did dress him he didnt even see a single shift 90% of the time....ya thats doing lots for his development, it shows they dont trust him enough to play so what was the point in keeping him on the team. Hes not benefitting from sitting on the bench & watching.

One sad thing too was sending Vasko back to europe, im not sure if anyone of u attended any practices prior to trade deadline but he was by far the next best skilled player on the ice behind Schiedl & Klimchuk....the guy had a very quick release & could skate. I think the conditioning problem they said was a joke excuse, the 1 practice out of 3 i seen Cameron blew his whistle 3 times in a matter of 15-20 mins & told Vasko to "dump the f##ken puck in, instead of pulling up" the guy wanted to create a play instead of making his team fight to get the puck back by chipping it in deep. I think it was more of a "were sending you home cuz you dont want to play our style of play" maybe Volek had a bigger reason to stay away this year..... it does make a person think dont it...
Was curious how Rossignol's been doing since being reassigned and see he's got 21 points in 16 games in the BCHL. Top 10 P/G in league. A very puzzling decision by Regina, but glad to see he's doing well.

ThoughtfulObserver
03-04-2013, 04:29 PM
And my vote was coaches.

nivek_wahs
03-04-2013, 06:56 PM
Like I said dmeico saw 2 shifts brooks 1 and the other guy 0. Gay was a scratch. I watched the whole game just to see how many shifts they would get. Sad really.The "other guy" Bryar Ortynski had more than 0 shifts. Although he didn't see his first shift until about the 7 minute mark of the second period he played a few shifts (was even a plus 1). D'Amico and Brooks played sparingly but they had more than 2 and 1 shift (but not many).

But I'm not going to argue the fact that the Pats fourth liners play very little. I know Coach Conacher has a lot of pride and wants to win and I bet the losing is really taking its toll. I'm not going to say that the Pats should fire him or keep him, but the management needs to reevaluate the way this team seems to be regressing. Something is definitely not right.

Bighat
03-04-2013, 07:36 PM
I'm just poking fun bryar I know his name.

patsdude114
03-04-2013, 09:23 PM
Like I said dmeico saw 2 shifts brooks 1 and the other guy 0. Gay was a scratch. I watched the whole game just to see how many shifts they would get. Sad really.

I know D'Amico saw more ice time then shifts & same goes for Brooks...Brooks alone saw 2 shifts on the PP in the 2nd period... but argueing about who saw more shifts is stupid ur counting is wrong just for ur info lol

but i agree Conacher needs to play these guys more i mean especially in a weekend where we played the other 2 basemetn dwellers in MJ & BRN now we got EDM PA SAS & SC (twice) all playoff teams & MJ again) these games minus the MJ 1 is setting these players up were talking about to fail so dont see them getting many shifts.

Also i must say it is nice to see Rossingol having success in the BCHL he should of never been reassigned to begin with

patsdude114
03-05-2013, 06:39 PM
Taking a look at next years team with just returning players alone...

20yr olds- Ouellette, Fenske, Stevenson, Slyvegard are the only possible returnees for next season but I just don't see Slyvegard coming back after a very underacheiving season this year. I could see Lang bringing in another 20yr old to create some competion for the 3 returning guys if the price is right, I'm still unsure if Fenske brings enough to be a 20yr old he has limited skill, yes he plays physical but didn't show no toughness this season so maybe time for that ship to sail. Underwood brought a lot more then Fenske even though he got caught in a numbers game cuz Jobke returned for his injury riddled season.

19yr olds- Stephenson, McCoy, Samoridny, Rodewald, Christoffer, Hak & Henry will fill these roles. Altho I am on the fence about Henry making the team next season. Stephenson if he can finally stay healthy which I believe he will, he missed out on an NHL training camp this year but he will attend WSH caamp next year & hopefully comes back with more confidence & ready to finally be that elite player which he was dubbed when the Pats selected him. McCoy, Samoridny & Rodewald bring size & strength which hopefully all 3 come back stronger & ready for a bigger role within the leadership group. Christoffer I believe will be given a chance between the 1st & 2nd lines thru out the season he has really showed that he has some offensive flare to his game in the 2nd half which will be needed next season. Hak will become a depth guy prob be the 3rd/4th man.

18yr olds- Klimchuk, D'Amico, Hunt, Gay, Hand, Burroughs, Williams will be the core of our team & hopefully all of them can build on these development they had this year. Burroughs will anchor our defense next season as he has really came into his own since xmas this year. Williams will be the #2 guy both him & Burroughs play a simliar game & expect Williams to really become a bigger part in the offense (I'm still holding out that he will score yet this year). I think the Pats missed Hunt's energy this year after suffering back to back concessions with only playing 2 games all year. D'Amico I believe still has some offensive upside to him & he will get every chance to show it next season, if he fails a change of scenery may be needed. Hand I hope he comes back with a better understanding of how he needs to play to be successfull at the WHL level, he needs to bring his physical presence on a nightly basis & not be afraid to drop the mits regularly. Gay I'm still unsure of, I hope he brings it & can have some offensive production early on, I believe he has until xmas time to prove he is worth a roster space still.

17yr olds- Brooks, Ortynski, Mumby not a very strong group, I believe preseason they will be given every chance in the world to prove they are ready for a bigger role but outside of Brooks I don't think the other 2 really cut it. Hopefully the summer time proves me wrong with these guys, as a lot of growing & maturity can happen.

Sacher is our starter coming out of camp & believe he is ready to be a #1 guy his backup is still unknown. I wonder if the Pats have any plans for Beukeboom to push Sacher for this job at all. I still think Beukeboom can play at this level he could be a trade asset right out of camp or before if needed. Maybe we caan get a deal like we got for Guhle a few yrs ago which brought Scheidl over from RD.....

Was a rough season & hopefully we can get off to a quick start next year & build on it throughout the season. I think a lot will depend if the coaches let our guys play a more creative style or not. These past few games has been a nice slight change in the systems which are very noticable especially against the MJ's & BRN's

Bighat
03-05-2013, 08:22 PM
D'amico will be a 19yr next year and he'll be on the bubble, with 2 new Ureos coming in I see 1 being a forward the other a puck moving dmen. Williams will be a 3 dmen won't play him and Burroughs together. I agree with the rest of your post eccept we don't know what our 16yr olds can do for the lack of play except mumby and I don't really like his game.

patsdude114
03-05-2013, 10:48 PM
One age mistake isn't so bad when everything was done off the top of my head as I was bored while waiting for my dump truck to warm up before going to haul snow.

As for the Williams thing just cuz he won't be playing with Burroughs doesn't make him a #3 Dman lol as it is right now Burroughs is our #1 & Williams is our #2, 90% of the game either 1 of these 2 guys are on the ice for us, there D partners change through out the game but these 2 are the 1s who log the most minutes there for making them #1 & #2 Dmen. Just cuz Hak is usually paired with Burroughs doesn't him our #2 Dman. Most teams separate there #1 & #2 Dmen to have either 1 on the ice virtually all game.

patsdude114
03-09-2013, 01:04 PM
Does anyone else feel cheated as a fan since trade deadline? All we ever played was chip n chase as soon as we hit the offensive blueline but since the home & home against MJ we have been actually making plays at the blueline & creating offense. The players haven't changed but yet the style has changed slightly. I know myself being a season ticket holder who has been stressing for awhile now that we play too much chip n chase definately feels cheated with how we have been playing lately.

I've always said there is a time and place to play chip n chase but you have to create offense at the blueline. I always knew we had enough talent to play a more offense game then what we were playing with the dreadful chip n chase 100% of the time. Any player who is playing in this league should be able too create something in terms of offense they just need to be given the chance.

Can someone please explain to me what the Pats see in Ortynski? The 2 worst shifts the Pats had last night against PA was cuz he was on the ice & makes soft plays that just leads to turn overs. He better mature over the summer & be willing to pay a price next year cuz we have a strong group of 16yr olds coming next season & he very well could (& imo should) be on the outside looking in when it comes to the final roster.

I also thought Henry played a very good game last night, he can play hockey when given ice time early on to get himself into the game. I've also heard a lot of talk from fans who are really likeing Slyvegard on the blueline, with his recent play on the blueline do the Pats maybe consider bringing him back as a 20yr old euro Dman? He has been a great all around player for us this year, yes he had problems scoring but there is a lot more to being a responsible player then just scoring. I know the euro's should be scoring though especially a forward but if playing defense he wouldn't need to be a scoring threat. I'd rather have him over Fenske, at least Emil can move the puck & make the smart play. Fenske gets over looked/over rated due to his physical play. Yes we lack that for the most part but is he really worth a 20yr old spot for such a 1 dimensional player? We've released better 20yr olds over the yrs, only thing in Fenske's favour next year is we may only have 3 20yr olds at camp

patsdude114
03-09-2013, 08:59 PM
To anyone thinking that we haven't changed the way we have been playing needs there head examined. We've scored 13 goals in 5periods something we didn't do all season long under the dreadful chip n chase all game long.

Definately wasn't expecting the Pats to be up 7-3 after 2 periods in stoon, still a period to go lots can happen but wow really makes a season ticket holder feel ripped off all season long. Even if its just since trade deadline, like why wasn't the players given more freedom to create a play before hand?

patsdude114
03-09-2013, 09:40 PM
tough loss after being up 7-3 but on the flip side for the Blades it showed great character to not fold the tent....2 real bad turnovers on the 4th & 5th goals gave the Blades all the hope they needed to attempt a come back.

Was a very entertaining game to listen to

Fight Guy
03-09-2013, 09:49 PM
Shouldn't have ended when it did. Klimchuck was out front of the Blade net and was blatantly tripped while trying to make a scoring play, and the Blades send it the other way and score. Really should have been a penalty, but it wasn't. Pats were standing around most of the third like they had the game in the bag. Wasn't till S'toon tied it up that they started playing decent again. Definitely can't be letting this Blades team control the puck the way they did in the third. The outcome is not surprising.

patsdude114
03-09-2013, 10:10 PM
It sounds like it should of been a penalty but the game should of never got there to begin with. We shouldn't be giving up 4 goals in the 3rd period to begin with. As good as we played in the 1st 40mins we were horrid in the 3rd

Fight Guy
03-09-2013, 10:52 PM
Yep...exactly.