View Full Version : 2013/14 Roster
This a week or two early but its a month to training camp and I have some time now so I will start it off. looking only at the PPL
As a result of the strength of the draft of 97 born player (2012 draft) the roster could include 4 or 5 16 year olds this season and with the talent and size of this year draft another 3, 4 or 5 16 year old players next year and that is very encouraging for 3 and 4 seasons from now.
Tenders:
Sacher, Beukeboom, and McCauley all 19 will compete for the starters job. Gora (17) and Schneider (16) will battle for the back up. The WHL has a rule that any 16 year old must play 40 games and if that includes tenders I think that would rule out Schneider unless just being dressed and on the bench counts. They drafted another 6 foot tender (Chapman) this year but he is not eligible to play this season.
D-Fence:
Burroughs (18), Williams (18), Sinitsyn (19) for sure. Either Fensky or Holland both (20) will fill one spot. Brady Reagan (16) and Robbie Fulton (16) are both serious contenders and that is 6 d-men. the remaining will fill the 1 or 2 spots (16s) Brendan Kallis, James Hilsendager, (17s) Chase Harrison, Eric Donald, Griffen Mumby, (18s) Tye Hand (19s) Steven Hak, Darian Henry, Kade Pilton and 3 college players Nolan DeJong, Alec cCrea and Brady Skjei.
that make 12 players for 2 spots. I thought at the spring camp Kallis was very steady, stay at home d-man and very coachable but that would be 3 16s and the 40 game rule be very restrictive for juggling the lineup. Either Hak or Hand (I get them cunfussed) showed a lot of improvement last year so should be concidered.
Forwards:
(20s) Dyson Stevenson and Trent Ouellette, (19s) Chandler Stephenson, Jack Rodewald, Carson Samoridny, Marc McCoy, (18s) Mogan Klimchuk, Braden Christoffer, Goerdie McGuire, a question mark Dryden Hunt. (17s) Adam Brooks, Maxmillan Klammerer. If you add 2 (16s) Ryker Cole, Rylee Zimmer, Adam Berg and Colton Kroeker have a leg up for those spots but the remaining (16s) have a chance Liam Finlay, Drew Litwin, Jared McAmmond, Angus Scott and Austin Wagner. 2 (17s) forwards are on the PPL Bryar Ortynsky and Dane Schiolerand and 19 year old Patrick D'Amico.
The first gruop with 2 (16s) and Hunt is 14 forwards, so only 1 or 2 spots up for grabs. I could see a trade of a tender for a (17) forward
Lots to ponder and looks what could be a very competitive camp. The team could have 4 (16s) this season.
Look forward to all you posters thoughts and comments
GO PATS GO
Missed one forward in Conner Gay an 18 but he will need a good camp to keep a roster spot.
patsdude114
07-27-2013, 02:35 PM
I don't believe Hollan has any intentions of coming to the CHL unless his NHL drafted team wants him here (which I doubt) as for Fenske I don't see much of a point in keeping him around as a 20yr old as Hak & Hand provide the exact same role & don't fill a 20yr old spot. Fenske didn't bring any toughness at all last year, not 1 fight it was like he was disinterested to even be here last year.
Christoffer is a 19yr old this year I believe & should be able to fit into a top 6 role as he really came on in the 2nd half & found his groove. We should have a nice big line this year in McCoy, Rodewald & Samoridny that is if Cameron plays them all together as believe they are all rightys as well.
I think there is more then just a couple forward spots up for grabs, I'm not sold on Ouellett making as a 20yr old either I think there is room for an upgrade but it won't hurt my feelings if he is back either :) Gay, D'Amico, Ortynski & possibly even Brooks will be hard pressed to keep there roster spots.
I think we will have a good top 3 on our backend lead by Burroughs with castoffs of Williams, & that Russian to follow suit. Hak I believe will make this team as well but I believe every other spot is wide open & 1 of those spots belongs to Reagan already so 3 spots (most likely as we tend to carry 8 Dmen a lot) are wide open for the picking.
Lang will make a trade during camp/preseason, to open up a roster spot or 2, we have a returning roster that are capable of playing in the WHL (except maybe Ortnyski) just won't be all on our team.
This year camp will be very interesting as there is so many different looks our roster could look like with a strong group of 16 & 17yr olds looking to crack the roster. I think a couple of 16yr olds left off the roster last year are going to prove a lot in camp that they shouldn't of been over looked last year. IMO no way Ortynski & Mumby make our team this year.
Our goalie situation is prob going to be the most interesting to watch unfold. We got 3 19yr olds competing for the starting job & only so much crease time to prove they want it. I'm sure 1 will be dealt to play a regular spot on another team & then 1 will be flat out released off the PPL.
I'm still very confident that we will be in the 5th/6th spot next year be year end, I don't see us having such an injury plagued season again like last year & Stephenson & Klimchuk will be a tough dual to stop. Klimchuk will score 45+ this year (yes I'm saying it) he is going to benefit a lot from Cameron's style of coaching compared to Conacher's chip n chase game plan.
Think we agree on most: but I think Fulton is a lock on d, he is 6 ft 4 in 185 lbs last year AAA midget averaged a half point a game and a chip on his shoulder with 103 PIMs, a rough tough d-man, we can use.
Fenske last year ended as a plus 7 while Hand is minus 2 and Hak a minus 7. I think Fenske played more time against the other teams top lines than Hak or Hand. He was not showy but his stats show he got the job done
You could be right about Brooks I just thought there was a lot of improvement in his game as the year went on and hopefully he worked this off season to get stronger.
As you mentioned Cameron's style for the team should be more puck possession and that will allow the skilled players to develop and to shine.
Holland was a recent add on to the PPL so I assume they have some inside info that he will be leaving the NCAA. He was injured most of last year but the only way he makes the club is to beat out Fenske for a 20 d-man.
Bepoleon
07-27-2013, 04:54 PM
I believe Holland has been on the PPL list for a couple years now. I think they kept on the list because college enlisted players do not count as part of the 50 (I could be wrong).
patsdude114
07-27-2013, 07:41 PM
I believe Holland has been on the PPL list for a couple years now. I think they kept on the list because college enlisted players do not count as part of the 50 (I could be wrong).
Holland was on the Pats PPL before he got drafted & enrolled into the NCAA which you are correct he doesn't count towards the PPL cause of that reason but he is still the Pats property should he reconsider a CHL route for his final year of being able too (which is highly unlikely)
As for the Fenske comment yes he does play a hard nose game don't get me wrong I love his game in the D zone but when he gets that puck on his stick he is no better then Mumby was/is...... Hak has that flare with the puck he makes a lot of good plays with it. The +/- stat can be a very over-rated stat at times but with that said Fenske should of had a better stat as Hand & Hak were virtually raw rookies last ywith very little experience
One week to camp and I am looking forward to it. With that in mind and to start a discussion on the 2013/14 Pats I will offer a porjected lineup. I know camp and trades will bring to bear something different than I post here but its a start and others thoughts are always welcome.
Goal
Macauley / Gora
Defence: in no order but possible pairing. I did not concider L or R hand shot
Williams/ Sinitsyn
Fenske / Reagan
Burroughs / Fulton
Williams / (Hak) (Hand) (Donald) (Kallis) (Pilton) A BC paper has Pilton returning to Pat camp. Kallis would be the third 16 year old on D and the league rule that 16s must play 40 games would limit lineup adjustments from game to game.
Forwards: in no order but possible lines
Stevenson / Klimchuk / Stephenson
Christoffer / Ouelette / Maquire
Rodrwald / McCoy / Samoridny
Klammerer / / Hunt???
that leaves 3 or if Hunt is out 4 spots for Gay, Dane Schioler, Ryker Cole, Adam Berg, Rylee Zimmer, Colton Kroeker, Austin Wagner Liam Finlay, Jared McAmmond. IMO only 2 of those spots will be 16s and that would give the roster 4 16 for sure and if Kallis makes the D it would be 5 , 16s.
An interesting camp, this years team should be younger bigger and more skilled. Malcolm's coaching will be a joy to watch if we play a possession style as he has said we will. Lastly next year the roster will see at least 3 more 16s so the 2016/17 and 2017/18 saesons look very promising but that is a long way off.
As always other posts are encouraged and appreciated.
patsdude114
08-21-2013, 05:45 PM
Goal
Macauley / Gora
I really don't see MacAuley stealing the job from Sacher, Sacher had a very strong season last year at a level higher then MacAuley. Only way I see Sacher not being our starter is if Lang has a deal in place that would bring in a decent 17yr old forward that can step in right away since we are weak at the 17yr old group up front.
Defence: in no order but possible pairing. I did not concider L or R hand shot
Williams/ Sinitsyn
Fenske / Reagan
Burroughs / Fulton
Williams / (Hak) (Hand) (Donald) (Kallis) (Pilton) A BC paper has Pilton returning to Pat camp. Kallis would be the third 16 year old on D and the league rule that 16s must play 40 games would limit lineup adjustments from game to game.
In my opinion I think Hak & Hand both bring the same thing as Fenske brings as both are younger I think they become more valuable then Fenske is, Hak was 1 of our most improved players last season and I think he has a big role on our defense to fill this year behind Burroughs & Williams. With that addition of Sinitsyn I think it makes Fenske expendable while still developing Reagan, Fulton & maybe Kallis. Pilton is most likely just a body for camp, I don't think he has a chance of making the team after he walked out on the team last year for failing to want to go on the ice after he gave Revel a licken. Plus you forgot to mention Mumby (who I don't think has the skill to make the team as others just seem to be ahead of him.
Forwards: in no order but possible lines
Stevenson / Klimchuk / Stephenson
Christoffer / Ouelette / Maquire
Rodewald / McCoy / Samoridny
Klammerer / / Hunt???
that leaves 3 or if Hunt is out 4 spots for Gay, Dane Schioler, Ryker Cole, Adam Berg, Rylee Zimmer, Colton Kroeker, Austin Wagner Liam Finlay, Jared McAmmond. IMO only 2 of those spots will be 16s and that would give the roster 4 16 for sure and if Kallis makes the D it would be 5 ,16s
You did forget to list Brooks in your list as I do think he is still a lock to make the team, he has potential still even as a smaller forward. Also you forgot Ortynski and im not going to comment on him as many of you guys know my feelings on him but hey a year older things can change that's what camp is for right? I really like our forward group this year, has very good size and everyone can skate well, if Stephenson can stay healthy this year both him and Klimchuk should be around the 90pt range. I hope Rodewald took some boxing lessons or some type of fighting lessons, if this guy ever learned how to handle himself in a fight he could be a force, as he skates exceptionally well for a big kid and the guy hits like a truck from his speed. Adding a fighting element to his game would make him very intimidating in our division.
I like all of our possible 16yr old forwards this year I don't think either guy is a wrong pick, unfortunately there will be some guys sent back to midget. I think Berg has a great chance at making this years team then many may give him credit for, seeing him in the spring camp he was a quality player and was 1 of the 1st forwards on each drill to catch on what the coaches wanted to do.
Really wish the camp wasn't opening during the week, makes it tough to attend all day sessions, I may be limited to just the evening skates which kind of sucks. But I wont think twice if a slow day to just park my dump truck and head down to the rink.
PD 114 You are right I forgot Brooks but see him as on the bubble as for the others I did not mention (Mumby Ortynsky) and others are very long shots to be on opening day roster.
I disagree with you on Fenske IMO he is top 4, so you and I can agree to disagree on that.
As far as the tenders Chad L will trade one. Macauley has a lot of playoff experience is a big tender and I just think he may be a late bloomer. Camp will sort that. It may be Sacher / Gora Either way goal tending will not be weak.
Go Pats Go
patsdude114
08-21-2013, 11:12 PM
I think Brooks showed a lot of promise last year, he wasn't ready for a lot of the minutes he logged last season due to so many injuries. I think the Pats wanted to bring him along abit slower then it worked out but he should be able to take advantage of those minutes he did get last season into his development this year in hopefully taking on a bigger role. He had some good flashes at times of what he could be capable of doing as he matures and hopefully adds some muscle.
I don't think Mumby or Ortynski make our roster out of camp, I see Mumby falling into the same path as Bortsmayer did. I questioned the Pats keeping Mumby last year right out of camp as Donald was 10 times better then Mumby was, now with that said there as rumours Donald wanted to keep his NCAA chances alive which may of been true in why Mumby was on the roster and not Donald but also Harrison I thought was better as well at last years camp but the knock on Harrison was his weight as a WHL Dman so I think Mumby made the roster as a 16yr old on defense by default cause Koberstein was not ready by any means.
This years camp I think will be very interesting, I believe there are a lot of veterns who will be pushed for jobs guys like Hak, Hand, Fenske, Mumby, Ortynski, Gay, D'Amico, & maybe Hunt to some degree as well since he missed a full year of development from his concussions last year. If he gets another 1 early on in the season he can pack his junior career in as 3 of them within a years time is not good for the brain. It would be sad though as Hunt was such a little spark plug for the Pats in his rookie year, was becoming a fan favorite as well.
As for the MacAuley, Sacher, Beukeboom goaltending situation what a great problem to have going into camp, all 3 should be in the WHL this season but realisticly the Pats only have room for 1 of them as I do believe the backup spot will be Gora's...I believe Beukeboom is going to have that fire in his eyes this camp as he wont want to be cut again out of training camp, I think he will push Sacher even more then MacAuley will..... I think the bigger questions will be.... which goalie will be traded 1st and how long do we carry 3 goaltenders into the regular season??
I think if Moodie faulters out of camp the Blades will come calling for 1 of our 19yr old goalies.
Trianing camp schedule is now posted on the Pat web site
Tiger Trauma
08-22-2013, 02:58 PM
MacAuley last year with the Tigers looked very good in camp. He stole a spot away from a vet(Kenny cameron) that played with the Tigers the previous season.
However once the regular season hit when everyone's vets came back he started getting lit up. He is a very big goaltender and takes up a lot of room, but had rebound control issues, and agility was questionable.
He put up very good numbers in Junior A leading the Yorkton Terriers to the Western Canada Cup, getting Co-MVP honors so maybe his technique has rounded out. His 2nd half numbers skyrocketed.
Regina spent a 4th on him, so they must think he has a fairly good chance at sticking.
patsdude114
08-22-2013, 03:40 PM
Tiger Trauma I agree with you I do think he is capable of playing in the league as many have labeled him as a late bloomer, it wouldn't surprise me if the Pats carry 3 goalies for 2 or 3 weeks into the season & show that we have 2 goalies who can play at this level & wait for a trade to take place. Or just got with 2 19yr olds in goal & have them both push each other for as long as it will work, altho I don't see that taking place with our youth movement.
witness
08-23-2013, 08:50 AM
I think MacAuley was picked up as an insurance policy. The Pats want to go young this year, but if your young goaltenders start to falter...
Rather than shatter a young guys confidence, you want your insurance policy to kick in.
I would like to see an up grade in the 20 year old positions. You need a top two d-man and a top 6 forward as 20's. That is a reach for both Fenske and Oulette.
I will be interested to see how Dane Schioler plays at camp. His play improved in AAA last year. Can he contribute??
My dark horse in camp is Drew Litwin. I like his game and just may make this team as a 16 year old.
AlanC
08-23-2013, 11:44 AM
As for the MacAuley, Sacher, Beukeboom goaltending situation what a great problem to have going into camp, all 3 should be in the WHL this season but realisticly the Pats only have room for 1 of them as I do believe the backup spot will be Gora's...I believe Beukeboom is going to have that fire in his eyes this camp as he wont want to be cut again out of training camp, I think he will push Sacher even more then MacAuley will..... I think the bigger questions will be.... which goalie will be traded 1st and how long do we carry 3 goaltenders into the regular season??
I think if Moodie faulters out of camp the Blades will come calling for 1 of our 19yr old goalies.
Outside opinion here:
I can't help but think you are overrating your goaltenders just a BIT. I mean, you have three 19 year old goalies with a combined 52 games in the WHL. Two of them weren't even good enough to play in the WHL as 18 year olds and the one who did, posted an .883 save percentage. The probability is high that all three of them are, at best, average to below-average WHL goaltenders and so realistically one of these guys is going to play for the Pats this year just because they have nothing else, and the other two are going to go finish their junior careers in Jr A.
Going down the rosters of all the teams, I believe it is a very good possibility that the Pats have the worst goaltending situation this year in the entire WHL. If there's going to be a goalie trade involving the Pats, I think it's more likely the deal involves the Pats ACQUIRING a starter rather than it involves other teams lining up to get their hands on these three 19 year old undiscovered gems.
Just my two bits.
witness
08-23-2013, 04:04 PM
Alan, you opinion is always valued.
To be quite honest with you, the Pats need a little of everything.
Goaltending wise. I think that Sacher can do the job. We were able to watch him at times last year. Most of his starts were on the road. He did OK. When the wheels fell off on some of his games were due to some suspect d zone coverage. Remember that Hewitt's numbers as an 18 year old were not all that impressive (.890).
The Pats need to beef up their d. To expect two 18 year olds to be 1 and 2 are unrealistic. And Williams and Burroughs are not that type of talent. They would be more comfortable at 4 and 5. there are some nice prospects coming up, but at the older age group the cupboard is bare.
And we need scoring. There is a bunch of 'character' guys on the list, but we need a couple of more guys (other than Stephenson and Klimchuk) to score more than 30 points.
Toswammi
08-24-2013, 12:04 AM
The Pats need to beef up their d. To expect two 18 year olds to be 1 and 2 are unrealistic. And Williams and Burroughs are not that type of talent. They would be more comfortable at 4 and 5. there are some nice prospects coming up, but at the older age group the cupboard is bare.
Sounds like Swift, where all defensemen are 18 and younger. However it doesn't hurt to have a trio of guys that have or are projected to be top two round Nhl draft picks in that group
patsdude114
08-24-2013, 11:06 AM
The Pats need to beef up their d. To expect two 18 year olds to be 1 and 2 are unrealistic. And Williams and Burroughs are not that type of talent. They would be more comfortable at 4 and 5. there are some nice prospects coming up, but at the older age group the cupboard is bare.
May be alittle biased opinion here but imo Burroughs was playing above & beyond his 17yr old age status last year. He was basicly our #1 Dman all year (especially in the 2nd 1/2) it wasn't like Jobke & Fenske were available much in the 2nd 1/2 & Burroughs took that role & ran with it, he was just shy of a point/game during that time. Our defense would of been 10 times worse without Burroughs, his play in the back 1/2 of the year got him drafted by the NYI & he climbed up in his draft status as well with rankings.
Just remember at the junior level its a new season at the start as well as just after xmas too these kids mature at different rates. Burroughs has been 1 of those players that benefitted from playing on an older team during his rookie year which helped him greatly to the player he is becoming. He gets to attend a NHL camp this fall too which will show him where his level needs to get too.
We got 4 players attending NHL camps this year & every player always returns better then before they left. Those 4 guys will be leaned on a lot this year & fully expect all to produce at the level that's expected of them.
I really don't think we will be as bad as some may think, we would of been a playoff team last year had we not had like a bazillion injuries. Also Sacher is not a below avg goalie, to judge him fully on the SV% stat alone is just flat out stupid especially when you see the team that played infront of him on a nightly basis with all the injuries. The wins he did get he stole wins most of the time & held us in games besides a few where it wouldn't of matter had Hewitt been playing.
AlanC
08-24-2013, 07:33 PM
Also Sacher is not a below avg goalie, to judge him fully on the SV% stat alone is just flat out stupid especially when you see the team that played infront of him on a nightly basis with all the injuries. The wins he did get he stole wins most of the time & held us in games besides a few where it wouldn't of matter had Hewitt been playing.
I wasn't judging Sacher purely by his SV%. But it IS a bad SV% and you can directly compare him to Hewitt, who played behind the exact same team and posted a .903 save %. That's an extra goal every 50 shots, or if your team allows 35 shots per game, that's an extra .67 goals against per game when Sacher was in net rather than Hewitt. That's pretty significant.
Basically, the numbers suggest that unless there is a huge improvement in Sacher's performance this year over last year, then if he's your #1 goalie then you guys better get ready for a long year.
Of course I could be proven wrong, we'll have to see. But those numbers should be cause for alarm among Pats fans, not optimism IMO.
patsdude114
08-25-2013, 04:19 PM
There was a whole whopping 1% difference between Honey's SV% & Sacher's SV% so guess with what you said prior his numbers should be alarming as well going into this season.........correct? (If I remember correctly you are a WKs fan, not that I truly care what team you cheer for though)
Also comparing a 20yr old goalie to a 18yr old goalie is showing how little you truly know about junior hockey. Ill just leave it at that......
For all we know maybe Sacher & MacAuley all over acheived in the roles they were in & the Pats will be left with nothing to work with when it comes to goaltenders. Guess that's why there is training camps & a season to be played....
There was a whole whopping 1% difference between Honey's SV% & Sacher's SV% so guess with what you said prior his numbers should be alarming as well going into this season.........correct? (If I remember correctly you are a WKs fan, not that I truly care what team you cheer for though)
Also comparing a 20yr old goalie to a 18yr old goalie is showing how little you truly know about junior hockey. Ill just leave it at that......
For all we know maybe Sacher & MacAuley all over acheived in the roles they were in & the Pats will be left with nothing to work with when it comes to goaltenders. Guess that's why there is training camps & a season to be played....
I think Alan is a Hitmen fan, though he can correct me on that. I think it's easy to take save percentage for granted. I used to not pay much attention to it and always focused on the G.AA but when you see a goaltender with a G.AA of 3.00 or higher but he has a save percentage of over 90, you gotta look beyond the net and look at the team he's on. I tend to look at the % more as I think it reflects more on the goaltender then the G.AA does. Just my opinion.
Having said that, I dunno much bout the Pats goaltenders so I won't comment on them but I will say I think their going to be better then the Blades although Spencer Tremblay who is trying out has looked good and according to some close to the Blades feel that he could end up being the starter. So if he comes in and takes the starting job and shows well then that will be a relief to the Blades. Moodie's save percentage last year by the way was a whopping .84 lol ouch.
AlanC
08-25-2013, 07:56 PM
There was a whole whopping 1% difference between Honey's SV% & Sacher's SV% so guess with what you said prior his numbers should be alarming as well going into this season.........correct? (If I remember correctly you are a WKs fan, not that I truly care what team you cheer for though)
Also comparing a 20yr old goalie to a 18yr old goalie is showing how little you truly know about junior hockey. Ill just leave it at that......
One, SV% is a tough thing to compare between goalies from different teams because the circumstances from team to team can be so different - quality of the team around them, whether the team plays a defence-first approach, etc. You CAN compare between goalies on the same team though since they play behind the same defence and within the same system.
Two, I am aware that players tend to improve as they get older. The biggest jump is usually from 17 to 18. 18 to 19 is smaller and 19 to 20 is usually negligible. I never said that Sacher couldn't improve, only said that his improvement from 18 to 19 needs to be pretty significant or the Pats goaltending situation is going to be a problem.
Three, I'm not a Wheat Kings fan so you must have me confused with somebody else. I'm not sure how what team I'm a fan of makes any difference in having a civil discussion about the Pats' fortune. But if it does matter, this is me: http://smallatlarge.blogspot.ca/
To add my two cents. and to throw in some more stats Macauley playoff stats are GGA 1.94 and save % of .932. If one assumes that as the Terriers went deeper into the playoffs their opponents would be better and better teams and at some point those teams might be as good as the average WHL team. Those are impressive tender stats.
Alan C: your posts, opinion and blog (http://smallatlarge.blogspot.ca) is always respected and appreciated by this poster.
patsdude114
08-25-2013, 08:38 PM
I fully get where your coming from when trying to compare 2 goalies on the same team but yet also still a tough task as well when you factor in age & experience within the league. Then the great difference in styles of play between both Hewitt & Sacher, then throw in how much of a roller coaster season the Pats had with players in and out of the lineup on any given game due to the ever revolving door of injuries.
One having watched Sacher all year long and seeing how he progressed all season long I do believe Sacher will improve on his season from last year as his numbers really didn't show his level of play. Im not saying by any means the Pats goaltending will be tops in the league but I do believe the goaltending will be good enough to win games and get into the playoffs (baring another injury plague season within the team).
Also I am still on the fence about MacAuley, yes he put up stellar numbers in Jr. A but still its a big step down from the WHL level. I attended a couple SJHL games about 5 or 6 yrs ago the hockey is a significantly lower level then the WHL.
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