Where Have We Gone Wrong

[TheBrass]

Alrighty, I'm posting this based on the assumption that most of us are responsible adults with jobs, bills to pay, etc.

Why is it that my company cannot seem to draw any applicants who are actually interested in working a 40 hour week? The wage is good ($13.50 for 3 months, going to $16.50 if everyone is happy with the situation), full benefits after 3 months. No responsibilities, work your 8 hours and go home, along with potential to advance in the company (most guys here make over 23/hour). My latest hire has been here for 2 weeks, missed 2 days, and shown up 3 hours late on another day, I'm loathe to get rid of him because no one else is applying.

This isn't an actual call for resumes, but seriously, for manual labour in a manufacturing shop, is this too little to pay? We don't ask for previous experience, hell, we don't even ask for a high school diploma (our current sales manager got his GED long after beginning his employment here). Any ideas about how to entice the strong back of the world??? I'm at my wits end, thanks in advance for your responses.

[Big Daddy]

As a business owner for the last 13 years I have noticed this same trend. I see it as a sense of entitlement from the 20-30 year olds in the job market. I am in construction and we don't usually see societies best and brightest but the work ethic was always there. Now, it is different. I think most of the slackers had lazy childhoods, no chores, no part time jobs, and parents that were to easy on them. They often come to me as their first job, at 20 or so, and I have to tell them the basics: show up on time, take regular breaks, work a full 8 hours, when there is time enough to lean there's time enough to clean, etc. Basic stuff they should have learned long ago. If they don't get it during their probation period (90) days I let them go. But I never keep them because if you allow this to happen you will have a mutiny on your hands.

[langdak]

I think i know what the problem is............. :skeptical

[Tinner]

Well guys, just come to Alberta, especially Central and Northern Alberta. Because of the price of oil and the spin off economy it directly affects, finding help is the problem. Once you find someone, getting them to work is another. As an example, Tim Hortons is paying starting staff 16 - 17 bucks an hour in some centers to get help. In Red Deer, my son has friends working in the various oilfield related companies that are making upwards of $10,000 to $15,000 a month....thats working 21, 12 hour days and bonuses. Now, because of the wages being paid, there's no shortage of workers (for the big bucks) businesses are finding them, but cant keep them, because some other outfit will offer more. The ripple effect of that is these same people won't work for other businesses because the wages are lower. And btw, most of them want the same wage benefit package that it has taken me 30 years to get. They want 6 weeks holidays, paid sick days, fully paid health care, time off at their choice and if your lucky, they'll work 8 hours a day.

That said, there are still people out there that will give a honest days work for a decent wage. Its finding them and keeping them that makes all supervisors jobs important. So, hopefully the company you work for will see that and increase your benefit package......here's hoping!

[TheBrass]

Thanks for the responses guys, I always wonder if other businesses have the same issues, or if in my case it is just an industry-type thing (dirty job, heavy lifting, etc). My other concern was that being close to downtown Vancouver means that people who can afford to live in the area are people who need to make a higher wage to support that life. My colleagues further out from Van. have similar issues, but a lot more bodies applying for the jobs too.

Ams Fan..........not to worry about langdak's comment, since I'm his boss (wow he's not going to like that statement) at home I think he was making a crack about me on a personal level.

The issue of motivating people is such a tough one to cope with, if I knew what made everyone tick I would tell you; we could write a book and retire. I've always gone with the tactic of being nice until an employee forces me to be otherwise, but maybe I just need to toughen up over all and start holding people more accountable.

Keep the suggestions coming, for all you non-managers on the board: what gets you motivated??? I get the feeling that your answers will help a lot more people than just me.

[The_Vulk]

My work place has had a help wanted sign out since last August (if not sooner).

We staff close to 900 people, and are still short staffed. We even had to borrow some workers from a sister warehouse in Ontario (paid travel fare, hotel, food). And we have been working 50-60 hour weeks (and during what is considered our slow months) for those wishing OT (and a few departments that made it mandatory).

Last year, it took me until the Labour Day long weekend to have made as much OT hours as I have in the first three months of this year!

My company has used so many temp agencies (over the last few years) to get help that we have lost count.

Our economy right now is HOT, but to maintain it we don't have the population base for it (or the housing to shelter them in.)

And with the Baby-Boomers about to retire in-mass, the worker shortage is going to be getting worst, not better.


And with the economy as HOT as it is, the number of high school drop-outs joining the workforce has been going up (as least here in Alberta). And those that my company has taken in are just like Big Daddy said, they don't know what 'working for a living' entails. They'll do some of the work, then hide that which they don't like/forcing someone else to find and finish it, or try to correct the mistakes done on what they did do. It is not like not finishing as assignment completely, or handing in a incomplete report, in the business world, you can't do that. The work has to be done, or your done.

Personally, the PUSH for the bottom line in the way north american companies have been working no longer works. The committed workforce is no longer there. Their drive to be the best, most efficient, continued growth, etc is being eroded not by the competition, but more so from within.

We can't continue to grow if we can't keep employees, and we can't keep them treating them as we did fifty years ago, or ten years ago or even five years ago. Loyalty to a firm is no longer that high on most people's minds (just as job security has decreased, so to has job loyalty.)

The expectations of workers and employors differ, especially with the younger workers today. How to motivate workers is also a lost art. Infact where I work, their policies and how they treat their employees is counter-productive to that, IMO. (Which might also explain why my company has fired/let go so many managers/supervisors.) They can't get the job done within the corporate culture. There are no bonuses to being the best, but incentives to keep everyone at the lowest common demoninator. The rewards to do better, faster, more effeciently, are not there, so why try. That is the corporate culture I have seen/heard from too many of my friends in other firms as well as what is happening in mine.

Labour shortages.
Not understanding the needs/wants of the employees.
No loyalty between job/company/workers.
Increasing starting wages, but what of the other wages/pay scale to keep those one already has?

No clear cut answer, I'm afraid.
More questions than anything else. :(

[Number_4]

This is an interesting thread for someone like me. I'm a 22 year old uni student, attempting to finish a double degree in Sociology and Human Resources Mangament, so this kinda falls right into my knowledge.

The problem is not necessarily you motivating people to work, its the people that dont have the motivation themselves. If some of you look back on what you were like when you were younger, perhaps some might recall a certain lack of satisfaction with your jobs. I think motivation comes hand in hand with satisfaction. If your not happy and satisfied at the end of the day, you may not be totally motivated to come back and work another day. Many of you responding so far have worked for quite a few years in order to get where you are, far above that starting wage. Over time, you have learned to adapt and enjoy your jobs, or at least accept that you will have good days and bad days. Many younger people dont realize that its not all good, bad days happen too.

I wouldnt blame yourself for high turnover rates. Its not your managment style, its partly the people the industry attracts too. Some people go into manual labour because that is exactly what they want to do, and those are the good ones (the needle in the haystack) that you want to keep. The others are there for a wage, and perhaps some know that they have pretty good job security no matter what they do because of the markets out there. Once your 18, you have a pretty good idea about where you are heading, and if your heading towards higher education or not. It takes some kids longer to accept the more physical life, and those are going to be the kids that arent as productive. The ones that accept it, give it their all, are the ones that are going to stick around and advance. And correct me if Im wrong, but isnt there kinda a mentality amoung some young workers of party, rather than work? If I remember the oil workers and construction workers Ive met in the past couple of years, its party hard on days off, dont give a crap, etc mentality. Not exactly one of good quality workmanship. I may be overgeneralizing here, but I do think the trends are there on some job sites.

Now to talk a bit about high school dropouts, the rates have increased, yes. Why? Perhaps its the industries that are willing to pay the big wages. In Alberta especially, between construction and oil, you can make some BIG bucks without a diploma. Several guys I know have dropped out of uni, moved to Alberta, and now are making big bucks, giving their parents the lip service that they will go back to school eventually. For most of them, I doubt it. Now, in 2000, there was a national wide survey done on teens. 95% of teens expected to pursue a career then, and 86% expected to get the job they wanted when they graduated, while 62% of them expect to stay with the same career for life. Now if that doesnt sound idealistic, what does? I mean, for such a high percentage to expect their life after high school to be perfect, easy and stress free, they are in for a rude awakening. Combine that with the fact that only 44% of students thought they would have to work overtime to get ahead, you can imagine what kind of work ethic is being taught today.

I think ive covered just about everything. Basically, its not going to get any better. The values that you were taught as a baby boomer are not as existant today, especially with the 'lock and key' child of today. Both parents have to work, children are being left to raise themselves, and values like hard work are being forgotten, and exchanged for 'the more money you make the better it is' ideal. Kids are seeing their parents come home exhausted and cranky, and it shows, because a growing amount just dont seem to expect to be happy. Sigh. It is kinda depressing.

[Flathead]

Well guys, just come to Alberta, especially Central and Northern Alberta. Because of the price of oil and the spin off economy it directly affects, finding help is the problem. Once you find someone, getting them to work is another. As an example, Tim Hortons is paying starting staff 16 - 17 bucks an hour in some centers to get help. In Red Deer, my son has friends working in the various oilfield related companies that are making upwards of $10,000 to $15,000 a month....thats working 21, 12 hour days and bonuses. Now, because of the wages being paid, there's no shortage of workers (for the big bucks) businesses are finding them, but cant keep them, because some other outfit will offer more. The ripple effect of that is these same people won't work for other businesses because the wages are lower. And btw, most of them want the same wage benefit package that it has taken me 30 years to get. They want 6 weeks holidays, paid sick days, fully paid health care, time off at their choice and if your lucky, they'll work 8 hours a day.

That said, there are still people out there that will give a honest days work for a decent wage. Its finding them and keeping them that makes all supervisors jobs important. So, hopefully the company you work for will see that and increase your benefit package......here's hoping!

Couldn't agree more, it's hard to compete with the oilfield and Alberta in general. Want the big bucks move Alberta. Although I do have some friends slowly coming back to Sask. There is a lot of good work happening in and around Swift and it's rumored to be the next place to "take off." I know at the job I'm at we can't compete with oilfield wages. If I didn't enjoy my job as much as I do I would be in the oilfield as well.