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RDRebelsfan
02-22-2005, 10:51 PM
I'm going to sum this up as best I can. Gary Bettman is forever going to be known as the man who drove hockey into the ground and pissed on the ashes. The man should be hung for treason.

So how did it happen?
The year was 1994. Gary Bettman was an NBA executive. As a matter of fact he was Commisioner David Stern's right hand man. The NBA owners loved him. Together with Stern, Bettman increased the owners profits like never before. He was successful as all hell and very well paid. He could have held the posistion for the rest of his career if he wanted.

And he should have.

In 1994, the NHL owners looked for a new commisioner. They saw what Bettman did for the NBA and offered him the job. He immediately took it. The Owners weren't thinking about what would be good for the sport when they made this decision, they just saw dollar signs. They thought Bettman would make them rich, richer than they had ever been. So they hired a man who previously had never even attended an NHL game.

This was 1994. The Rangers had just won the stanley cup, ending their drought. The cup was in New York City, the 2nd biggest TV market in North America. The NHL was getting loads of media attention from this and the sport was doing very well. The NHL should have fed off the momentum of a New York cup and carried that into next season. Instead,

Lockout.

I mean, could there have been a worse time for a lockout? This was a time when new fans were flocking to the NHL. The sport was growing, and Bettman, not even 1 year into his new job, calls a lockout.

Not only that, but one of Bettman's first acts as commisioner was to change the names of all the divisions and conferences. Just eliminating a part of hockey's history. I wonder if he even knew who people like Clarence Campbell or Norris even were.

And then came expansion. I'm not knocking Tampa Bay or Phoenix fans, but come on. Hockey in Florida? Arizona? Nashville? Carolina? San Jose? Why the hell does California have 3 freaking teams? Why does Florida have 2?

Unlike Football, Basketball, or Baseball, Hockey is a regional sport. You can grow up just about anywhere learning to play football, baseball, and basketball. Kids in Florida, Phoenix, and California don't play ice hockey. Why? BECAUSE THERE'S NO FRICKEN ICE.

Canada. Bettman could care less about the country that invented the sport. He took teams in Quebec and Winnipeg and moved them to Colorado and Phoenix.

Granted, Colorado is a very successful team both financially and playing wise, but it was wrong to sacrifice Quebec.

Hockey in the desert is just absurd. That is like night and day. They are polar opposites.

Moving Hartford to Carolina? Jesus Christ. Detroit Fox Sports did a segment during the 2002 Cup Finals when they pitted Detroit fans against Carolina fans on their hockey knowledge. Out of 10 Carolina fans [who signed up to be part of this by the way] only 1 could even describe what icing was.

Expansion is what really killed the league I think. It watered it down, and it just wasn't successful. Its because of teams like San Jose, Anaheim, Tampa Bay, and Florida, teams that can't fill their arenas that Owners have cried for a salary cap and cost certainty. Well dumbasses, what the hell did you expect? The NHL was doing fine before those teams came along and dragged everyone else down.

Look at Detroit, Toronto, Philadelphia, Colorado, and New York. They are all successful teams, they always have full arenas and GASP. They're all in the North. Anyone taking a hint here?

Bettman should have done the right thing and admitted he made a mistake by expanding when those owners started complianing. He should have bit the bullet and stepped down rather than call a lockout to satisfty some of the owners but obviously not all of them.

Do you really think the owners of the Detroit Red Wings and New York Rangers are going to sit back and accept another season being cancelled or the lockout going on into next season? There's going to be mutiny.



You know, honestly, I'm all for boycotting hockey until the day Bettman steps down. Goodenow too. I will be physically sick if either of them are still around when the NHL finally resumes. [If it ever resumes. This could very well be the end of the NHL]

Such a great sport, that's given us the miracle on ice, years of great players, probably the best playoffs in any sport, is just about dead. And what does the man responsible have to say? He was quoted at his press conference last Wednesday saying "I have absolutly no concerns that the fans won't come flocking back"

You ****ing idiot.
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ihlemic10
02-22-2005, 11:24 PM
:clap:

That is all I have to say. I believe the only way that the lockout will be resolved is if Bettman resigns. IMO there is no other way to end it perminatly.

Again, :clap: to you for that post.

RDRebelsfan
02-22-2005, 11:28 PM
:clap:

That is all I have to say. I believe the only way that the lockout will be resolved is if Bettman resigns. IMO there is no other way to end it perminatly.

Again, :clap: to you for that post.



I posted this on another forum I go to with Coyote fans on it...of course I am being flamed by them....but they know it to be true.

Tiger Trauma
02-23-2005, 12:04 PM
Good post man I agree 100% with ya

ScottyWazz
02-23-2005, 02:03 PM
Well thought out post, and you're entitled to your opinion. But a couple things.

1. How do you explain the success and how the fans have taken to the Dallas Stars?? Once they moved from Minnesota-- the people of Dallas, through time, came to the games and are still coming to the game. A vert successful team too. Also, to group San Jose in the same field as Anaheim and Florida is absurd. They have been one of the most successful teams, gaining pointing in each of their past 5 years except for '02-'03.

2. The Red Wings and Rangers owners have all different business ventures, same with most NHL teams. Sure they aren't making the same bank as they would if the NHL were in session, but they still make some kind of money kind of money when there's no hockey around. According to the Forbes report, the Red Wings lost 16.4M last season, the Rangers 3.3M, the Flyers 14.1M-- and those are the top teams.

On the flip side, San Jose profitted 1.3M, Tampa Bay 8.6M, and Nashville 6.2M. Now remember-- that Forbes report is the contrary to the Levitt Report-- but seemingly shows the same results of most the teams losing money.

3. California is a good hockey town. The Kings and Sharks are very popular and have been in the past as well. Now, Anaheim being so close to LA was a mistake in the first place, but California is an up and coming hockey area. Maybe kids in the Dub are from California and I'm sure more will be coming. And Phoenix has been in hockey since the '70 in the WHA to rave reviews. Even now, there will the reincarnation of the Phoenix Roadrunners in the ECHL next season. Plus with Arizona and Arizona State having very respectable club hockey, Arizona is slowly becoming a new area for hockey-- all thanks to the Great One being a posterboy for hockey there....much like he was in LA.

To blame Bettman for doing what the owners wanted him to do then call him a "basketball guy" is a little much. If he really wanted to make the NHL a craptastic wonderland of fun, he would have opened up the season and teams like the Oilers and Flames would have issues competing, keeping their talent, and in the Oilers case, possibily move out of Canada to become the third victim of nothing being able to compete because not everyone is on the same playing level.

Expansion was too quick, too soon. The locations probably would be the same, but the time frame in which they were instated was too quick for the marketplace it was going into. I agree with that. I wouldn't have changed any of the locations, just the time that they instituted them.

I understand your position and respect it. It was a very good post and was very well thought out. If there was something where I could give you "reputation points" like on another board, I would. But these are just my thoughts when looking at your post.

RDRebelsfan
02-23-2005, 07:42 PM
To correct myself Bettman was hired in 92...came on in early 93....NHL has a president before in Jon Ziegler...not a commish lol

The_Vulk
02-24-2005, 06:23 PM
Expansion is what really killed the league I think. It watered it down, and it just wasn't successful. Its because of teams like San Jose, Anaheim, Tampa Bay, and Florida, teams that can't fill their arenas that Owners have cried for a salary cap and cost certainty. Well dumbasses, what the hell did you expect? The NHL was doing fine before those teams came along and dragged everyone else down.
Not a chance!

Go back before those expansions.

Back to when Edmonton Oilers Super Star Wayne Gretzky was traded to LA.

We knew then that the current teams could not hold onto their star players.

The Calgary Flames also ended up having to trade away alot of their star players because they could not afford to keep them.

That was 15 years ago!

The problems were here back in the late 80's/early 90's. Before Bettman's time.

Cost certainty was needed before those expansion teams. To say that it is because of them that we need it now is not looking at the history of the NHL.

Bettman increased the expossure of the league to US markets, new network national contracts, sponsers, endorsements, etc.

He did everything he was asked to do as commissioner. The only thing missing was the CBA that would make the entire league prosperous and competative.


As for the placement of franchises:

LA needed a closer/regional rival. So San Jose and Anaheim were the perfect choices.

Pheonix had the Roadrunners long before they had the Coyotes. And at Two Million people, it was a market waiting for a team.

The AHL, WCHL, ECHL, IHL, UHL, CHL (Central Hockey League) etc. had teams practially almost all the states.

Hockey was know in the desert, by the gulf of Mexico, in the Armerican heartland, along both ocean coasts, etc.


And just look at the CHL (WHL, OHL, QmjHL). We have twice the number of teams. Do you consider us watered down?

Just look at how exciting most of the games are.

The bigger problem is more the fact that the 'stars' have become concentrated in fewer and fewer teams. The haves and have-nots is what is truly ruining the game of hockey.

That is what needs to be FIX. And to do that, everyone must be on the same, level field.


The NFL is the perfect example. (Just ignore how complicated their system is, but more what that system has done.)

The players are wealthy, the owners are all making money, and the fans know that in any given year, their team can win it all.

I see nothing wrong with the NHL wanting the same.

But it can't do that, if the union continues to refuse to be a partner in it.

Hince we have Goodenow wanting to maximize the earning powers of the players, even to the point of losing teams (and players).

The MLB is what he wants, where money is no object, and it is usually the same few teams competing for the World Series, and the hell with the rest.

That is something the NHL (and its owners thru Bettman) are determined will not happen/no longer be the case.

Are you more willing to support your team, knowing they had a chance of being champs, or knowing full well they never even had a chance?

Bettman is doing a great job! Its Goodenow that has done everything to kill the advances the NHL has done, as he cares not for the game, its future, its franchises, its fans. All he cares about is how much money he can bleed off the owners/fans. It is about time he gets his head into reality, and deals with the facts.

It is well time the bleeding stops.

It is time to build for the future.

Bettman is looking to the future.

Goodenow is lost in the past, and has no grasp of today, let alone even tomorrow.

grumphy
02-25-2005, 12:26 PM
Good post, I don't fully agree with Betman being guiltless, especially with some of his choices with expansion, but you stated your case very well and have a lot of good points.

Blades 4 Life!
02-25-2005, 04:30 PM
The Vulk had some very interesting ideas. I dont think it is all of bettmans fault. Sure he canceled the season and is going of hard deals but Goodnow isn't doing a very good job either. I think they could both try a little hard. they make metting once every 2 weeks. they arent trying very hard.Bettman has made some pretty god statements and i'm behind him now!. goodnow really hasent had a good statement to back himself up. He Just blames everything on bettman. Just think, if Bettman gets what he think will do the league best, just think how much better the NHL season would be compared to what goodnow wants. Next NHL season will be great. :D