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Thread: Pats starting to fire engine

  1. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reider View Post
    Pats win 3-2 in OT against the Edmonton Oil Kings this evening at the Brandt Center. Apparently it was sold out (6484), but there were a lot of empty seats throughout the arena.

    2 of the 3 Pats goals were on on the power play. Mahura hit the cross bar at one point and Steel also hit the cross bar in the dying seconds of the 3rd period. Overall, I thought the Pats played pretty decent. They weren't able to find much success 5 on 5, except for Bradley's goal from the point. Credit to the Oil Kings for playing solid 5 on 5 hockey, however, it was apparent that the Pats regiment are in need of some more heavy arsenal. Hobbs' cannon from the point and Wagner's high end speed were noticeably missing tonight. This team definitely isn't the same team that played in the WHL finals last year.

    Bryan Lockner looks a little more nimble this year. Good speed, works hard and plays tough. It would be great if he could breakout offensively this year. If not, he still has value as a solid bottom 6 player. Dawson Davidson looks great jumping into the play and he looks comfortable doing it. I'm sure it will pay off offensively down the road at some point. Jake Leschyshyn looks pretty good for coming back from ACL surgery. Hopefully he has a great season. The Pats will need him to be better than last year and he was good last year. Tanner Sidaway has good speed, but he's definitely no Austin Wagner. Speaking of Sidaway, I'm not sure if everyone is aware, but Jeff De Wit scored two goals for the Kootenay Ice last night against the Everett Silvertips and was awarded the first star. Good for him, I hope he has a good year in Kootenay. I have no complaints about Tyler Brown's play over the last couple of games.

    Austin Wagner and Nick Henry will be huge additions if they both return to the line up this year. The Pats could use Hobbs and Jost as well, but I'm sure that's not going to happen. The Pats need some more big guns, players that can really have an impact the game. The Pats can't rely on winning games with power play goals, they're going to have to find a way to be more productive 5 on 5. The Pats definitely need more speed and skill and of course more size, grit and heart are always welcome.
    Agree with most everything you said. For about two and a half periods it almost felt like sitting through a really boring pointless movie. Offensively the boys were out of sync 5 on 5 and the first couple PP were just bad. They weren't winning any board battles and were being terribly out skated. Everything was just off a bit. An ex-hockey player who got seasons tickets beside me says it looks as if Steel is lost out there at times, maybe looking for Henry?? The other observation I thought had some merit was that Brooks brought so much skill, leadership and heart that he is missed more than can be accounted for. Hobbs firing in those bombs was a huge offensive and psychological advantage. As has been said before this team is just a shadow of the team here last season.

    Brown was pretty good tonight but likely not as good as Friday in PA. I hope he has turned the corner but his early season consistency is still a concern. Paddock needs a skilled forward soon to spread out the lines. He also needs a couple D-men real bad. Paddock has talked of his lack of speed in the LP, and it was highly evident out there tonight. A couple of our stars were abused tonight once again and that can't be allowed to happen. There must be a physical response ASAP. If that is allowed to continue teams will think they can abuse our stars without repercussion. That will lead to injuries down the line. Can't be allowed to happen. It's a lot easier killing a penalty when a guy steps up (instigator) as most teams only have a 20% chance of scoring anyway. The upside is there is an 80% chance they won't score and you have sent the message the abuse won't be tolerated. Paddock seems to have some problem with a tried and true WHL understanding.

  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by chopper View Post
    Agree with most everything you said. For about two and a half periods it almost felt like sitting through a really boring pointless movie. Offensively the boys were out of sync 5 on 5 and the first couple PP were just bad. They weren't winning any board battles and were being terribly out skated. Everything was just off a bit. An ex-hockey player who got seasons tickets beside me says it looks as if Steel is lost out there at times, maybe looking for Henry?? The other observation I thought had some merit was that Brooks brought so much skill, leadership and heart that he is missed more than can be accounted for. Hobbs firing in those bombs was a huge offensive and psychological advantage. As has been said before this team is just a shadow of the team here last season.

    Brown was pretty good tonight but likely not as good as Friday in PA. I hope he has turned the corner but his early season consistency is still a concern. Paddock needs a skilled forward soon to spread out the lines. He also needs a couple D-men real bad. Paddock has talked of his lack of speed in the LP, and it was highly evident out there tonight. A couple of our stars were abused tonight once again and that can't be allowed to happen. There must be a physical response ASAP. If that is allowed to continue teams will think they can abuse our stars without repercussion. That will lead to injuries down the line. Can't be allowed to happen. It's a lot easier killing a penalty when a guy steps up (instigator) as most teams only have a 20% chance of scoring anyway. The upside is there is an 80% chance they won't score and you have sent the message the abuse won't be tolerated. Paddock seems to have some problem with a tried and true WHL understanding.
    At the end of the first period, I was thinking the same thing. Something didn't seem right, so I just kept on watching the game. A few minutes into the second period I sent a message to a friend of mine who was sitting elsewhere in the building and asked him what was going on and I also stated that last years team would have scored three goals by now. Steel ended up with a goal, an assist and almost scored the game winner when he hit the cross bar with a few seconds left in regulation. I have come to the conclusion that Steel looks fine out there when he has the puck. I don't think there's anything wrong with him. I think he looks lost out there because a) He had good chemistry with Leedahl and Henry last year and they aren't on his line right now. b) there are quite a few new players on the team this year, some of them rookies, some of them acquired from other teams. I think the team is lacking chemistry in general and c) a lack of chemistry and elite talent on defense. Oksanen can put the puck in the net when Steel sets him up, but I think the team in general just needs more time to gel and more high end weapons.

    In the off season my vision was Steel playing with Henry and the Pats acquiring a high end left winger (or the pipe dream of Jost joining the Pats) to play on the left side. I had Wagner penciled in on the second line with Matt Bradley and Oksanen. However, what if Austin Wagner played on the first line with Steel and Henry? (if Wagner returns). I think Paddock is going to have to spend a good portion of the rest of the season getting these players to play better together and find a line up that is in sync.

    I agree on your other points about the Pats needing to get reinforcements soon and John Paddock learning from last year regarding the protection of teammates. It's clear as day that the Pats need some pieces ASAP and last year should be a lessen that the Pats need to protect their star players otherwise history may repeat itself.
    Last edited by Reider; 10-15-2017 at 11:10 PM.

  3. #23

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    In the latter half of the 3rd period there were some good things that happened. The PP came alive and the PK killed a later penalty to give them a chance. Edmonton got away with a couple too many men penalties so they deserved the one they got.
    A lot of fans at the game last night seemed to think that we simply don't have a top 4 defence. I really hope John can land one right away and another by deadline. also another good forward ASAP would be a heck of a boost and allow a better line flow.
    Steel, Leschyshyn and Bradley are all centers and in theory that's how it should go. They just don't have enough quality wingers to go with them. Because Steel needs someone to play with Bradley often ends up on the wing. Holmes is not a 1st line winger.
    We have a lot of straight line players who simply dump and chase but we need a couple playmakers. Lockner is playing well but no points. He needs to play with someone who has some offensive creativity to go with his drive and big shot.
    Paddock hopefully can add a couple of value added forwards soon. Brandon deserves kudos for adding Weiglitner and Weinger. A couple of real good acquisitions. They are making Brandon formidable even without Patrick. Good on them. You're up John!!!
    After 10 games the team is what it is. They have played together long enough for the coach to know what's what! It's time now to fish or cut bait. There are things that need to be done, sooner than later...
    Last edited by chopper; 10-16-2017 at 10:05 AM. Reason: type-o

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by chopper View Post
    Paddock hopefully can add a couple of value added forwards soon. Brandon deserves kudos for adding Weiglitner and Weinger. A couple of real good acquisitions. They are making Brandon formidable even without Patrick. Good on them. You're up John!!!
    After 10 games the team is what it is. They have played together long enough for the coach to know what's what! It's time now to fish or cut bait. There are things that need to be done, sooner than later...
    Everyone just needs to take a deep breath and relax. You want to compare this year's team to last year's team .... If I remember correctly last year's team stumbled into the playoffs playing the worst hockey of the year. PK was God Awful, the team was taking selfish penalities, and goaltending was sketchy. I would rather go through the growing pains now rather than the end of Feb.

    Henry is scheduled to be back the first of November. That is a top 6 forward added into the lineup.

    Fish or cut bait???? Really?? Yes, I think the Pats should be sellers. Of course they are going to improve the line up. But, why would you pay premium prices (when you really don't have the assets) now? Top end players will be cheaper in December.

    I really think that the Pats will wait until after the west coast trip to make an assessment of what they have. They have to have confirmation of Jost not coming (that will add a 1st rounder to the assets) and that Wagner is coming (that will add a 20 to the assets).

    Right now, at best, this is a .600 - .700 team. This team will improve.

  5. #25

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    Quote Originally Posted by witness View Post
    Everyone just needs to take a deep breath and relax. You want to compare this year's team to last year's team .... If I remember correctly last year's team stumbled into the playoffs playing the worst hockey of the year. PK was God Awful, the team was taking selfish penalities, and goaltending was sketchy. I would rather go through the growing pains now rather than the end of Feb.

    Henry is scheduled to be back the first of November. That is a top 6 forward added into the lineup.

    Fish or cut bait???? Really?? Yes, I think the Pats should be sellers. Of course they are going to improve the line up. But, why would you pay premium prices (when you really don't have the assets) now? Top end players will be cheaper in December.

    I really think that the Pats will wait until after the west coast trip to make an assessment of what they have. They have to have confirmation of Jost not coming (that will add a 1st rounder to the assets) and that Wagner is coming (that will add a 20 to the assets).

    Right now, at best, this is a .600 - .700 team. This team will improve.
    It might be interesting to note that Pats didn't stumble into last years playoffs. In fact they were 8-2 in their last 10 games and had won 8 in a row! That can hardly be called stumbling, at lest in my opinion it's not however it might be in some peoples minds. In fact the Pats had very few instances of stumbling. The BC trip may have been some of their worst play of the year. The sketchy goaltending was probably the biggest reason for that . The Pats had a tough playoff run but one bad goal a game will do that.

    Leschyshyn, Henry, and perhaps Wagner are all the same story. They expect it will take a month before Jake is back to form, but now he's not a difference maker. The same will apply to the aforementioned guys, it will be December and January until they would be back to true form. You can get a top 6 forward back but it doesn't mean he's playing like a top six forward. You can't project a team on what you don't have in your lineup, because you don't know what you will have when they get back. Only hope!

    Top end players cheaper in December????. History doesn't sustain that statement! Late December and through until January 10th, the prices go through the roof. In fact Paddock said last year he couldn't add a couple veteran players at the deadline because teams were asking far too much. That was probably the difference between winning and losing the in the final. Having to play 15 and 16 year olds in a league final won't end well for any team.That's reality in the Dub and most people know that. I think an astute manager would be fishing right now to see what he could upgrade his team with, before a 3rd round guy becomes a 1st round guy. That's the hockey Business!

    At best a 600-700 right now! Wow thats's incredibly optimistic I think, since they are playing .550 hockey and clearly in the 2nd tier of teams in the division. And they are probably fortunate to have that record considering they are minus −3 in goals for and against. Right now this team is a good distance from being a consistent .600 and they will need to play some phenomenal hockey over a very long stretch to ever get to .700. The Pats go in November to the States and if they could come back from the USA trip at .500 that would be a win for them. It will be a heck of struggle as they are good teams loaded with talent especially if Yamamoto goes back to Spokane.

    Two OT wins ago this was a sub .500 team and playing Brandon, Vancouver, and the high flying Royals could change that all again. Lets hope that 3 wins for us but it's entirely possible to go the other way……WE are not a real good crisp team now. There have been a few strides but we still need some help right now. There will always be some last minute deadline deals (except last year) for the Pats. They can add then as well if they can get something done. It is usually better and cheaper to get out in front on of these things, something Paddock likes to do. The team has been inconsistent and sub par since the season started including the last two wins. Their best game was in MJ but some suspect goaltending hurt. They need some major and minor moves because as has been said that this is not a normal season, it's Memorial Cup Host Year. Trying to get back to being as good as last season isn't the goal. The goal is to win a WHL Championship and then win a Memorial Cup. Even with a Henry and Wagner added to this team, that doesn't look probable based on the current personnel…..
    Last edited by chopper; 10-16-2017 at 01:26 PM. Reason: type-o

  6. #26

    Default Marco Creta and young d-men

    I've been watching all of our young d-men and this kid Creta seems to catch my eye whenever I watch him play. Although he is a bit small for my liking he looks very composed with the puck, and has a bit of an offensive upside. He only has 2 points but that's more than any of our rookie d-men and behind Smart by just a point . He has only played 6 games compared to 10. Zamula has some of the same traits as Zabrovskiy had and looks to be their prized rookie d-man. Owen Williams is a strong looking player as well and I hope we keep him. Gavlas started strong but seems to have dropped off a bit. I'm thinking a lot of teams will have their eye on Williams in any trade scenario but I hope they can hang on to him. Back to Creta; I think this kid could be a player from the little i've seen of him. However one doesn't know what team management thinks.

  7. #27

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    I agree. I think Creta has made Smart expendable and, although Smart hasn't looked amazing, he would be a nice trade piece to include in a trade. 18 year old kid, attended Leafs camp, probably going to be a 20 year old in the league... value is there.

  8. #28

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    I do not profess to be a good judge of talent, and appreciate and enjoy the discussion on the skills and talent of the players. What gets my goat is the team's lack of compete, the lack of urgency, the lack of desire to be the best. (going through the motions) It like they are content to be the host team and not the WHL Champions. That is on the players and the coaches as well. The lack of intensity makes it difficult to make a plan and know what needs to be traded away and what needs to be traded for.

  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by RWAH View Post
    I do not profess to be a good judge of talent, and appreciate and enjoy the discussion on the skills and talent of the players. What gets my goat is the team's lack of compete, the lack of urgency, the lack of desire to be the best. (going through the motions) It like they are content to be the host team and not the WHL Champions. That is on the players and the coaches as well. The lack of intensity makes it difficult to make a plan and know what needs to be traded away and what needs to be traded for.
    Great point on the compete thing. Right now Sloboshan is probably competing the hardest of anyone BUT when you look at the possible return of Wagner, and/or potential acquisition of Fischer, Fonteyene, Davis, Bajkov and a number of others, can he make the cut? Yet he wants to be here so bad that he works way beyond what the others are doing. The Memorial Hosts syndrome has surfaced before and it's tough on teams to motivate guys. Some guys feel they are working and giving enough in their minds. In reality they are not because there is something in the back of their consciousness telling them they have a spot in the big show locked up. A mindset that usually leads to failure. Sometimes a couple of significant trades are needed to shake them up a lot. I guess when you're not seeing a players best it's harder to determine if he should go. On the other hand how long can the team afford to wait before it's too late. Can't let the other teams get too far ahead of you. Nevver having home ice advantage is a tough go!

    Puckhead306 could be on point about someone like Smart being expendable and a good trade piece. When people talk about what we have to trade with, perhaps the answer might lay there.
    Last edited by chopper; Yesterday at 04:28 PM. Reason: type-o

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